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1982 XJ650 Tune up and resto - picture heavy

Discussion in 'XJ Technical Chat' started by runt262, Apr 4, 2013.

  1. runt262

    runt262 New Member

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    Hey Lads,

    Noticed that there aren't too many "build threads" here, but figured I would start one on my bike to post on-going progress

    New member and new owner of an 82 XJ650 Seca. Just acquired this from an Uncle and plan on getting it back up and running to ride for the summer while I rebuild my 68 Triumph Bonneville. This Seca was originally a parts bike, and I am happy it didn't get pilfered too much. Engine turns over and gears select nicely. Haven't dug into it too much and will be a little slow due to the purchase of a first house. But I'll post a few questions about the bike.

    So things it needs:
    Front brake calipers and reservoir/controls. They don't exist on this bike
    Air Box(look for questions down below)
    Some electrical components(pictures posted below)
    Wiring Diagrams
    Handle bars and grips.

    So it need's little to get the thing back to its glory...cross my fingers. I imagine I'll find more issues as I go along. Here come the pictures and some more specific questions.

    Bike:
    [​IMG]

    A peek at the clutch. No oil, but everything in there looks pretty clean
    [​IMG]

    Any idea on part name and number? This is located on the left side, behind the air box under the panel that has the rectifier.
    [​IMG]

    Where do these wires call home?
    [​IMG]

    CARBS!
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    A couple of carb questions:
    1. I have noticed in the carbs, a slide valve that is not controlled by the throttle cable. The throttle cable seems to only sync and control a butterfly valve behind the slide valves. Are the Slide Valves vacuum driven or do my carbs need work to reattach to the throttle cable?
    2. If they are vacuum driven, then is the picture above only a Positive Crankcase Vent? Or is it part of the vacuum system?
    3. If this is part of the vacuum system, is this tube part of the reason why these bikes run like junk without the stock airbox?


    I am trying to avoid putting any money into this because I am cheap, and my Bonneville is getting more of the attention anyway. BUT! If anyone in the Toronto area has any spare parts I could buy off of them, that would be awesome! Any insight or advice into getting my bike up and running would be appreciated!

    I'll be posting with progress as I go along.
     
  2. Icebergh

    Icebergh New Member

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    I just picked up 82' Seca 650 that has been in a warehouse about 12 years. I hope it is going to work.
    Question for you or ANYONE; should i pull of the clutch cover and crank case cover so that i could spray some sort of soaking oil on things? I am not "that guy" when it comes to motors. However, I am determined to become very comfortable. The goal is to get it rollin down the road for my son's last summer home before shipping of in the Navy.
     
  3. Foolber

    Foolber Member

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    start a new thread please! :wink:



    and runt, not sure on the carb question, they are vacuum controlled and all slides should move when you twist the throttle, not sure if that helps you or not :( as for the hose, it is your crankcase breather. it attaches to the airbox on the front lefthand/center part of the box (there should be a 90 degree plastic hose coming out of your box) it looks like it is plugged up, was that the PO? if so thats not good, then the motor couldn't breath and who knows for how long :(


    the wires on the top of the fender look like your rear blinker and/or brake light wires :) as for and little box with the green, black, and red wire im not sure, POSSIBLY the blinker relay??? the Wizards will chime in here and know whats up.

    shame on you :lol:
     
  4. runt262

    runt262 New Member

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    It sounds like I will have to take the Carbs off and inspect them anyway. Nothing is moving on the slides so I will have to see what is up.

    I figured it was a breather. Just a basic PCV. I was taaking a look at it last night and it is infact plugged. But the bike hasn't been running for years, so I have a feeling the dirt in the breather came during its storage. I took the line off and inspected in the crank and there was no evidence of any dirt or muck. I think I am safe so far. It's just a little bit of loose dirt right now


    Is there a wiring diagram anywhere? I have a feeling I should be taking the harness off and inspecting everything.

    Parallel twins turn me on.
     
  5. bigfitz52

    bigfitz52 Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    They are vacuum operated, but only the butterflies should move when you twist the throttle if the motor is off.

    These are "CV" (Constant Velocity) carbs; the slides are lifted via manifold vacuum and not directly controlled by the throttle.
     
  6. quebecois59

    quebecois59 Well-Known Member

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    Welcome here!

    As already stated. you should be able to move the carb slides up with your finger. If not, it means they are stuck in gasoline varnish. That is pretty common with bikes that have set (sit?) for many years. Shoot some spray-can carb cleaner on the slides through the open end, it should help loosening them, I guess, before you pull the carbs off and dig in them.

    Be careful with the slide rubber diaphragms under the carb top covers, if they look like they have shrunk, spray some silicone lubricant or even drop some gasoline on them and put the covers back on, the rubber will become more souple within hours and less susceptible to break. If the diaphragms are already cracked, don't bother with this soaking step, you will have to change them anyhow.
     
  7. runt262

    runt262 New Member

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    So is this the reason why Pod Air Filters make these engines run awful? Not enough vacuum to actually created to lift the slides? I could just end up creating a plenum instead of tracking down a stock airbox and just make my own correct? Obviously best case scenario would be a stocke piece, but worst case, I can make my own.

    I think i might just take the entire carb bank off and do some inspecting anyway. Take the top hats off and check in the diaphragm's for condition and just ensure completely that they are moving free and clear of dirt.

    As a sidenote, super happy with the amount of activity on this board!
     
  8. quebecois59

    quebecois59 Well-Known Member

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    Go ahead, you will have to pull them off anyhow! Take several pictures as you work for further reference.
     
  9. tskaz

    tskaz Active Member

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    A. Don't guess, that can get you into trouble.

    B. You'll need to pull the carbs off and give them a good cleaning anyway, so skip the spray. When you clean them don't soak the rubber bits in carb cleaner.

    C. Your blinker relay is underneath the petrol tank, so that's not it.

    D. The wires with the bullet connectors are for rear stop/turn/running lights.
     
  10. 750E-II_29Rbloke

    750E-II_29Rbloke Active Member

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    Agreed ^^

    Except that the wiring colours to the box seem to tally with flasher unit... I wonder if that could be the self-cancelling unit? Would help maybe to see the top side of it and if you post how many & what colour wires to it as I can't see any of the tracer colours (the smaller stripe down the wire)...
     
  11. quebecois59

    quebecois59 Well-Known Member

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    I would agree in general, but I can't see what kind of trouble you're talking about in this specific case. Spray-can carb cleaner won't harm anything.
     
  12. runt262

    runt262 New Member

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    I got to spend some time on the bike tonight. Didn't do much except take the carbs off and swear at the spark plugs. I really don't need to tear too much down on this bike. I think the old owner must have prepped the bike for storage or winter, then forgot about it. So I'll explain in sections: Fuel, Electrical, and Swearing.

    Fuel:
    Gas tank is a little gross. No pictures, but I took it off and it sounds like a baby rattle. What should I be cleaning the inside with, and should I be sealing it with something? I intend on putting a hefty inline filter or two before the carbs.

    Took the carb bank off. Nice and easy for the most part. Played around with the slides and found that 3 of 4 were moving. No spray needed. The one stuck slide was Cylinder 1(Assuming you're sitting on the bike and #1 is the far left cylinder). So I took the top hat off Carb 1 and inspected it. Rubber is all good. No cracks. Slide is in great condition and no grit or dirt on the carb walls. Nice to see.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]


    The needle had some gum on it though. Which was why it wasn't able to move at all. Popped it out with a stick of soft wood and cleaned the jet off. All other 3 carbs felt smooth and felt vacuum restricted. I'll inspect those when I have more time. I will likely open the bottom half of each carb to do a quick clean and inspection.
    [​IMG]
    Curious about Carb#4 though. The screws on the butterfly valve are rusted. I'll need to inspect that a little more.
    [​IMG]

    Electrical:
    The previous post about that nasty, crumbled, smashed piece that was close to the rectifier. I think I might have issues without that. It looks as if it is directly wired into the ignition circuit. I will need a replacement. I am going off of this wiring diagram:XJ650 Wiring Diagram. The electrical piece is on the same plug as the rectifier, and is connected only to the Fuse Box, Alternator, and the Ignition switch. It has a Brown, Green and Black wire coming from it.

    I am also missing something under the seat(The bare plug). Red, brown, and a blue probably with white. Any ideas? There is another picture of it in my last post. I also have a feeling that it is part of the ignition circuit. Just trying to trace wires through the diagram and can't seem to find anything that fits the bill.
    [​IMG]

    Swearing:
    Spark Plugs. They are a bunch of a$$holes. They are stuck in there way too much. Not cross threaded though, lucky me. But just gummed in there bad. Check out my wrench and extension. Used a breaker bar because they were so tight. Couldn't get cylinder 4 plug out though. I gave it a soak with wd-40.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  13. chacal

    chacal Moderator Moderator Supporting Vendor Premium Member

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    That harness plug goes to the "cube" relay that SHOULD be encased in the (what appears to be broken) rubber "band" holder that is on the tabbed ear bracket just behind the self canceller..........

    http://www.xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic/t=27543.html

    scroll down to the section titled "Starting/Ignition Cut-Off/Neutral Safety Relay:"...........
     
  14. Orange-n-Black

    Orange-n-Black Well-Known Member

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    WD40 isn't going to cut it. You need some Kroil or a 50/50 mix of ATF and Acetone.
     
  15. runt262

    runt262 New Member

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    Quick question on these vacuum lines. There are vacuum plugs on each carb boot. I know Cylinder 3 is supposed to have a line that goes back to the petcock. Cylinder 4 though, is either missing the vacuum plug, or is missing a line. Which is it? Am I just missing the plug?
    [​IMG]
     
  16. midnightmoose

    midnightmoose Member

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    It is indeed missing the vacuum cap (which explains the rusted screws on the butterfly). Best to just replace all of them. They get hard and don't seal properly.
    I hate to burst your bubble but you won't be able to get that bike safe and roadworthy by being "cheap". Expect to drop at least $500 just to get started (tires-6 year lifespan, brake hoses-4 year lifespan, rear brake shoes- possible delamination, plus calipers, master cylinder, air box and anything else you know is missing). That's not factoring in any issues you've yet to discover. IMO a safe bike is nothing to be cheap about. Good luck and welcome to the best forum on the web!
     
  17. runt262

    runt262 New Member

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    Need not worry. Being cheap doesn't mean I'm spend $0 on the bike. Just dropped a couple hundred on brakes alone. Being cheap means its going to look ugly but run and function well. I'm not cheaping out on the important things. I value my life more than a quick ride into a tree. My wife does too! My life insurance policy isn't that attractive.
     
  18. 750E-II_29Rbloke

    750E-II_29Rbloke Active Member

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    WTH is this part then? :? Only thing I can think from the wiring colours & description is that it's got to be half an exploded reg/rec unit!!! (the part of it that dealt with adjusting the power to the field coils)

    EDIT-: yes it's got to be surely? If you unscrew the reg/rec I'd lay money that it used to be a part of it! So yes, name is regulator/rectifier unit, don't know part number though but Chacal will

     
  19. Orange-n-Black

    Orange-n-Black Well-Known Member

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    Plug.
    Didn't realize I was commenting on first page that had already passed. :lol:
     

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