(TESTING) 1982 XJ650RJ...No Spark

So...

I am the new owner of a 1982 XJ650RJ. I love it, but I would love it more if it had a spark and ran. Cosmetically and mechanically it seems to be in very good condition, but only time will tell. Full disclosure, I have a running 1983 XJ550RK as part of my collection so I have some parts available for testing. Here is the situation.

Configuration: I always have the side stand up, bike in neutral (indicator lights up) and clutch pulled when testing.

Battery: New, Fully Charged, hooked up to a battery tender during testing.

Fuses: Fuse box replaced, reading appropriate voltages in and out

Engine Stop Switch: Needs to be replaced, but should not be interfering with getting a spark. Registers 12 volts in and out when in run position. The voltage is cutoff and I can hear the relay click when switch is turned. The reason it will be replaced is that it will activate the relay if pushed down on, and I don't want that while i'm riding

Side Stand Switch/Relay: From what I have read, disable the TCI when ever the kickstand is down. For testing purposes this can be eliminated as an issue by either removing the relay all together or unplugging the B/W going into the 6 pin connector of the TCI. I have tried every combination.

Pickup Coils: Tested the resistances. Roughly 650 Ohms on one, zero no the other. This is leading me to suspect this is the main culprit. I monitored the voltage going to the TCI, and the "good" pickup coil generates a signal, the "bad" does not.

Ignition Coils: Tested Primary and Secondary Coils, both within specs.

Sparkplugs: Brand new out of box, but I also text with a screwdriver to cylinder head to eliminate doubt.

TCI: I have tried both the 1983 xj550rk TCI and the 1982 XJ650rj TCI. Neither will generate a spark.

I will be replacing the pickup coils, but I do not think that is the only problem. If so, I would definitely generate a spark on one set of ignition coils while using the know good TCI from my XJ550rk. By know means am I an electrical guy, but I've chased down all the gremlins that I can find. Please let me know if you got any ideas. I appreciate any help.

 

Testing Response

 

give this a try, go back to the pick up coils and test each wire to ground also. tci unplugged

 

I tested that when I was testing the pickup coils. An orange wire goes to one pickup and a grey to the other. A black serves as a common ground. I tested from orange to black and then from grey to black and got 650 Ohms and Zero Ohms respectively. Thats telling me a pickup coil is bad, and would explain why one ignition coil isn't getting the trigger to create a spark, but not both.

Also, I'm moving this to Technical Chat. Thanks for keeping an eye on this section though.

 

So...

I am the new owner of a 1982 XJ650RJ. I'm digging it, but I would love it more if it had a spark and ran. Cosmetically and mechanically it seems to be in very good condition, but only time will tell. Full disclosure, I have a running 1983 XJ550RK as part of my collection so I have some parts available for testing. Here is the situation.

Configuration: I always have the side stand up, bike in neutral (indicator lights up) and clutch pulled when testing.

Battery: New, Fully Charged, hooked up to a battery tender during testing.

Fuses: Fuse box replaced, reading appropriate voltages in and out

Engine Stop Switch: Needs to be replaced, but should not be interfering with getting a spark. Registers 12 volts in and out when in the run position. The voltage is cut off and I can hear the relay click when the switch is turned. The reason it will be replaced is that it will activate the relay if pushed down on, and I don't want that while I'm riding

Side Stand Switch/Relay: From what I have read, disable the TCI whenever the kickstand is down. For testing purposes, this can be eliminated as an issue by either removing the relay altogether or unplugging the B/W going into the 6 pin connector of the TCI. I have tried every combination.

Pickup Coils: I tested the resistances [Orange to black (ground), Grey to Black (same ground). Roughly 650 Ohms on the orange one, zero on the grey. This is leading me to suspect this is the main culprit. I monitored the voltage going to the TCI, and the "good" pickup coil generates a signal, the "bad" does not.

Ignition Coils: Tested Primary and Secondary Coils, both within specs.

Sparkplugs: Brand new out of the box, but I also text with a screwdriver to the cylinder head to eliminate doubt.

TCI: I have tried both the 1983 xj550rk TCI and the 1982 XJ650rj TCI. Neither will generate a spark.

I will be replacing the pickup coils, but I do not think that is the only problem. If so, I would definitely generate a spark on one set of ignition coils while using the know good TCI from my 1983 XJ550rk. By no means am I an electrical guy, but I've chased down all the gremlins that I can find. Please let me know if you got any ideas.

I travel during most weeks, so I will be ordering parts during the week and working on the bike on the weekends. This may delay my ability to test your suggestions. I apologize for the inconvenience and I appreciate any help that you guys can give.

 

Have a look here first look at the troubleshooting overview. As far as I know they are the same as the XJ series electrically, but the Vision is a twin.

http://www.jetav8r.com/Vision/IgnitionFAQ.html

I may be wrong as I am no electrical expert but I think your run switch may be the culprit and the bad pickup. A bad pickup would stop two cylinders firing and would indicate the run switch was working in the closed loop position. A bad run switch would stop the spark to all cylinders, the rider uses it to cut the ignition in an emergency. If it is not creating a closed circuit in the run position the engine cannot fire up.

 

the tci for a 550 wont work in the seca 650. they are wired differently . do you have the correct tci?
is this a non yics motor?

i had abad pickup coil and had a no spark on both coils

 

It would be odd for a pick-up coil to read zero ohms. If you did the measurements with the TCI connected then doing what Polock suggested might lead you to a pinched / chaffed grey wire that routes from the pick-up to the TCI.

 

Both of those are good pieces of info to have.
I was unaware that the TCIs were that different. I assumed that it was just different advance curves "programmed" into the module.
I ordered a set of pickup coils and they should be here next week.

 

I disconnected the TCI and tested the resistance at the connector (Orange to black, Grey to the same black). I am not sure how else I would test it. I also removed some of the insulation and inspected the wire. It turned out that the ground was damaged so I repaired it, but it didn't improve the no-spark situation. Lastly. I tested the grey wire for continuity and resistance and it seemed OK.

 

That's a hell of a document. It definitely taught me a lot. I have ordered a new set of pickup coils (should be in next week) and I will steal the switch off my running 1983 XJ550RK to rule that out as a problem. I appreciate the information and advice. I'll let you know what I find

 

I noticed one of the other members of the forum stated he had no spark at all when one of his pick up coils had failed. I assumed one coil failure would still let the bike run on the cylinders fed by the good pick up coil circuit.

 

Be careful with the TCI I believe the 550 has a different part number , sure others here can answer this better.

 

Merged.

 

the wiring for the non yics tci is different from the other tcis we did have a member who used the incorret tci but it was for yics and it started the bike did not run well.
I sold him a tci for his 550 his problems were solved.

 

So it kinda worked non-yics to tics, but did not run well? My pickup coils come Wednesday and I will have time to install them on Saturday. I do have the original TCI, but have no idea of it is good. If the pickup coils don't fix the problem, then I will start looking for another TCI. Does anyone know where to get a digital copy of the service manual? I have checked the forums but the links are all dead. Thanks in advance

 

The Non-YICS and YICS TCIs both have different advance curves. Using the wrong TCI will result in a bike that will start and idle, but it won't be rideable.

 

So I assume the advance curve is to do with the spark happening earlier at higher engine speeds?

 

Yes.