fed up with this bike

It has good days and bad days.

Sometimes it fires right up and runs great all day starts everytime, no problems. Thats on a good day. The next day it wont start. it tries and sometimes I get it started and it wont stay running. Thats today. Now tomorrow it will fire up and run fine. I dont get it. The carbs are getting gas, gas flows in the on, and res positions, and on prime the gas flows freely with no vaccum. the vaccum line has a good vaccum from the engine. All 4 spark plugs are sparking. The fuses are fine. I cleaned all the electrical connections. they are all ok. I'm at a dead end. Any Ideas?

 

I'm going to assume that you have replaced the fuse block, heaven knows how many gremlins hide in those corroded hunks of plastic garbage.

 

Unplug the Coils from the Wiring Harness. Clean the contacts really well. Put them back together.

Pop the Ignition Crankcase cover. Leave it off while you clean the Ignition Pickups with Isopropyl Alcohol and Q-Tips. Clean the surface of the Rotor with a ScotchBrite Pad or 1000 Finishing Paper.

Check the screws holding the Ign Pickups for tightness.

The next time it wont start ...

Pop the seat and lets some Propane Gas from your torch into the airbox and then try to start it.

What happens?
Do you have a new fuse panel Y/N?

 

Yes I have new in-line fuses where the panel was.

Coils? I'm assuming those are the 2 cylinder shaped things that the spark plug wires go to under the gas tank right?

[/quote]Pop the Ignition Crankcase cover. Leave it off while you clean the Ignition Pickups with Isopropyl Alcohol and Q-Tips. Clean the surface of the Rotor with a ScotchBrite Pad or 1000 Finishing Paper.[/quote]

What is, and where is the ignition crankcase cover, and what and where are the ignition pickups? and rotor? (assuming its the same as a distributor, cap, and rotor like a car)

 

Propane in the airbox:

I put a good blast of propane from the torch in to the vent under the seat, and the engine fired for about 1 second and then died as soon as the propane burned up. Then wouldnt start again, I shot it with propane again, and same thing, it fired for a second.

 

Sounds like a fuel problem. Have you tried switching to PRI?

 

Obvious fuel delivery problem.
Open a drain screw and see it the Carbs are getting fuel.

Then, depending on the findings ... we go from there!

 

where is the drain screw?

 

Right on the bottom right of the Fuel Bowls.

The left two should be facing outboard to the left and the right two ... outboard to the right ... IF the last person to do the Carbs did it right!

 

Look at this diagram (lower-center).

 

ok found em.

Now to get them open without chewing up the head of the screw.. they are old screws, and been in there awhile.

I ruined one screw, and the others are just as tight and I'm not going to force it.. WD-40 maybe??

 

WD-40 or PB Blaster and a good fitting screwdriver (no slop in the slot).

 

Since you need to have Drain Screws that are not stuck to:
Check for Fuel
Set Float Levels ...

I'm going to suggest you do this right.

Pull the Carbs.
Pull the Bowls.
Clean the Bowls.
Air Dry.
Apply some Vegetable Oil to the Screws and HEAT that Oil GOOD.
With an assistant Wearing gloves ...
You use a Hand Held Impact Wrench to remove the Drains.

Clean the Drain Screw threads.
Clean the Bowl threads.
Administer First Aid to the Slot on the Drain Screw.
(Or ... buy a set of Stainless Drain Screws)

Apply a light smear of NeverSeize to the Drain Screw threads.
Install.
Tighten.
Put back on Carbs that you have Cleaned since they are off the bike.
Set Float Levels on Cleaned Carbs.
Bench Sync.
Preset Mixture Screws.

Tweak.
Go riding.

 

Sometimes a good smack with a hammer does the job of loosening those stuborn screws. Place screwdriver in the slots and hit the end of the screwdriver with a hammer a couple of times. This is best done with the carbs off the bike and even better with the bowls off the carbs and then the bowls chucked in a vise with a towel around the jaw area so as not to scuff up the carb bowles. Not too tight though, Dont want to break or crush one of those hard to find bowls. This system will free up a lot of those stuborn screws. Have fun and good luck.

 

Ok I am going to attempt this carb cleaning feat tomorrow. Using Ricks how to clean carbs the old school way thread. If Im pulling the carbs off the bike, I may as well do the whole job, Im sure it needs it anyway. Do I need to buy new needles, and/or seals/gaskets, or anything before I start? or can I use all the old parts?

 

You can use all the old parts ~~> As long as you don't tear a Gasket!

Be sure to Pop-out the Emulsion Tubes ... The Brass Nozzle that the Main Jet screws in to. Get those Tubes white-glove clean and shined. Look through them from all angles to see the light coming in from the other side.

Twist 3 Pipe Cleaners together ... nice and tight ... and you can "Scrub" the Main Jet Pipe up through its center. The Metering Ports will have to be "Poked" with a Tool.

The best tool is a "Welder's Tip Cleaning Set" (4-Bucks at a Hdwe Store).

Use Screwdrivers that FIT the Slots on Jets or you can strip off the Heads.

If this is your first time cleaning Carbs ... DO ONE at a time. Make notes.

The BIG - BIG DON'TS are:

Don't strip the Heads off Jets.
Don't prop the Carbs and walk-away without making sure they won't fall.
DON'T break a Float Hinge Pillar using too much force to remove a stuck Float Hinge Pin. That's DEADLY!!!

Don't forget to re-finish the Diaphragm Piston Bore.
800-1000-1200 and Mothers.

Give it heck!

 

Hey rick, Just curious: How much would it cost me to ship the carbs to you to be cleaned, bench synced, and all the drain screws un-frozen with a new set? PM me and let me know.

 

Ok, I got the carbs off the bike, that went smoothly using the method in ricks thread. popped the float bowls off on the bottom of them are all rusted, and I beleive the metering ports are clogged. Thats as far as I am right now. I must run and get cleaning tools, and carb cleaner. I just wanted to take a peek in there to see what I am dealing with. I read the carb cleaning guide and it was hard to understand, now that I took float bowls off and seen whats in there and how it works, I understand it better. I will continue to post my progress. So far the parts that I need are float bowl gaskets, they were all cracked and brittle and came appart with the removal of the bowls. Oh and by the way there was gas in all 4 bowls so the carbs are definately receiving gas.

 

Dirty Gas.
You need to insure that nothing but raw Fuel reaches the Fuel Bowls. That Rusty stuff probably clogged you Pilot Jet and the Lower Metering Ports of the Emulsion Tubes.

The Starter Circuit Supply, is also probably clogged or close to it!

 

carb number 3's pilot jet is stripped pretty bad from PO (or last person that was in there cleaning) I cant get it off. I got all the main jets and the other 3 pilot jets off, got them soaking in carb cleaner, along with the brass needle valve spring things (that were hanging on the floats). Havent figgured out how to get the emulsion tubes out yet they arent attatched to anything, but they dont fall out. Im sure I can figgure something out. I havent figgured out how to get the brass nut off under the needle valve (the thing with the screen on it) without stripping the head, they are on there pretty tight. Thats where I am at. Havent got to the top side yet.

 

wait I just read that the needles under the float have rubber tips. OoOps. better go get those out of the cleaner bath before they sit overight. i got em, They are ok. brass is nice n lean tho). Dont get mad at me now, Im new at this.

 

The emulsion tubes just pop-out of the carb body, they are held in via friction (just a tight fit in the bore), although over time they can get stuck and need to be gently tapped on with a wooden dowel, etc. BTW, they come out from the "top" side of the carb.

The float needle seat "nut" is held in by a surprising amount of torque. Use
a socket on an extension---you want to make sure that the ratchet handle clears the tops of the float pin "arms" that are part of the carb body casting....break one of those and you'll need a new carb body!

I carry the float bowl gaskets, lots of hardware (screws, washers, etc.) for the carbs, and pilot jets, etc.:

http://www.xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic ... rt=45.html

 

ok I got the pilot jet out from carb 3. the head of it is pretty chewed up, I basically hmmered a new screwdriver slot in the head and impacted it out. the hole looks fine though. Do I still need a new jet? Ill post a pic of it here in a bit.

 

Ok here is a pic of carb 3 pilot jet.



Need a new jet? What do you think?

The other side of the jet is fine. the threads are fine, and gas will still flow through it. So I dont see the point of getting a new one only to look good inside the carb (which you dont see anyway).

 

Replace it!

I carry new ones:

Aftermarket Hitachi PILOT FUEL JET, sizes as follows, fits all XJ650 (except Turbo), all XJ750, and all XJ700 (exc. "X") models.

HCP885 #40 PILOT FUEL JET
HCP886 #41 PILOT FUEL JET

Either size jet above:

$ 3.25 each plus shipping
or
$ 11.00 for a set of 4 (mix-and-match different sizes okay)


Or I have good used ones for $2.00 each!

 

You can do a face-lift on that Jet and "Save it"

To get the Emulsion Tubes out:
First you take-out the Top Side Diaphragm Assembly's
Then, find a Cap Screw with the same thread pitch as the Main Jet.
Thread the Cap Screw into where the Main Jet seats.
Tap the Cap Screw driving the Emulsion Tupe UP and OUT the top.
(Once it gets loose ... it will probably want to fall out.)

 

They are New for Coffee Money ... replace it!

 

I got the emulsion tubes out. My question is can I mix them up and soak them all at once or do they all have to go back in the carb that they came from?

 

Mix-and-match!

If you are not going to break the rack apart, then the only parts that you really need to keep separate (so they can go back into their original carbs) is the slide piston/diaphram unit.....

Everything else is truly interchangable.

 

Once had an Old POS car that had a intermittant running problem... Finally... found it to be an old gas cap gasket that floated about the tank usually settling right on top of the fuel out hole.
Take OFF yr tank, Empty it, Flush it, Clean it carefully, then... try running yr Bike again.

 

Clean those Emulsion Tubes until they shine. Use a Brillo Pad and get them gleaming.
Then, twist together 3 Pipe Cleaners and wet them with Carb Cleaner.
Do the Inside Tube part; too.
Finally, use a little tool and poke-out the tiny Metering Ports until you can look right through them and see light from the ones on the other side.

Lastly, blow them off with Carb Cleaner.

While they are OUT ... shoot a heavy spray of Carb Cleaner into the Main AIR Jet. You should see the spray exit the Air Hole in the bore that that the Emulsion Tube fits into.

 

The main air jet...

Which is located under the rubber diaphram from the top side of the carbs right?

 

yeah it is, i see the air passage now.

 

Get one of these and fill it with the Spray carb Cleaner. Then ... POWER FLUSH:

The Main AIR Passage
The Pilot Jet and Air Passages
(Flush and back-flush the Pilot Air and Fuel Passages. Put a finger over the Pilot Fuel Jet hole and flush ... Put it in the Pilot Jet Hole and Reverse Flush.

 

the boogger sucker thing.. yeah thats a good idea..

what if I have the enrichment valves removed still?

 

All the better.

 

SO I think all 4 of my starter jets are clogged. I read somewhere here about the flashlight check to see if the starter jets are clean, I think I understand what that is talking about. The intake hole on the inside of the bowl is angled outward and connected to the starter jet passage (I can see a protrusion on the outside of the bowl) this passage is where the brass pin sticking out of the carb body inserts in to. Down inside there is a very small jet called the starter jet which supplys fuel to the enrichment circut and allows the bike to start when its cold. Please tell me if I am correct so far... Ok, I shined all kinds of light through that intake hole on all 4 of my float bowls, and I see absolutly no light coming through the starter jet. I think I am doing this right. let me know if I am not.

My conclusion is: this was my problem in the first place. Remember my bike would not start when cold. But sometimes it would, and when it did (and warmed up) it ran fine all day, until the next day (when cold again).

So please tell me I hit the nail on the head, with the correct hammer.

And if so, How do I unclog those jets. I already soaked the float bowl in cleaner overnight, that didnt unclog them, I filled the passage up with cleaner and it held the fluid instead of drain in to the bowl like it should (Im assuming). Should I poke something down in there? If so What?

 

z7) Aftermarket wire gauge Drill Bit for Bowl Starter Jet. As you will quickly discover if you ever try to clean or rebuild your Hitachi carbs, the tiny, non-removable starter jet that is stuck wa-a-a-y down at the bottom of a drilled passage in the carb bowl is next to impossible to clean. For one, did we mention that the jet opening is TINY? And did I also mention that it's stuck way down at the bottom of a small passageway, and basically unreachable? AND THEREFORE, NO ONE EVER REALLY EVEN ATTEMPTS TO CLEAN IT OUT? And that a clogged starter jet not only means trouble starting and idling, but that starter circuit is actually also involved in idle and off-idle performance? Well, how do you actually clean it? Even the tiniest cleaning rod in our HCP950 and HCP953 carb passage cleaning sets (above) aren't small enough to fit through this starter jet (it is THE smallest jet-passage in the entire carb)...

Well, here's how you clean it: with this tiny drill bit. Just big enough to get through the jet, but not big enough to ENLARGE the jet (that's a huge no-no), this high-speed steel bit can be gently rotated (but never "pushed", as it will break) through the toughest of crud. This is the only way to properly clean these starter jets.

NOTE: this is a TINY drill bit, and will not chuck into a standard drill chuck. You have to use a mini pin-vise attachment or do it carefully by hand...... ALSO: this drill bit is a mere 1-1/2" long, and as such, will disappear below the top "plane" of the bowl as it goes down into the jet. You will have to use a pair of very slim needle-nose pliers to grip the tip of this drill bit and rotate it!

HCP2296 Starter Jet Clean-Out Drill Bit
$ 11.95

P.S. how do you know when your starter jet is really, truly, zestfully clean? One of two ways:

a) shine a strong penlight or mini flashlight into the bottom of the bowl, where this jet passage "intake" is located. Look through the top of the bowl down into the jet passage "outflow" passage (this is the passage that the brass suction tube in the bottom of the carb body actually fits down into). Focus your eye carefully on the jet opening and make sure it's clean. P.S. it helps to do all this while in a darkened area....

b) put the spray tip (you may have to gently shape the end of it to a fine point) of a can of carb or brake cleaner into the intake opening of the starter jet and let rip a spray. A STEADY, FINE, POWERFUL STREAM OF FLUID WILL COME OUT OF THE OUTFLOW PASSAGE ON THE TOP OF THE CARB BOWL IF THE JET IS PERFECTLY CLEAN AND OPEN. I mean this stream will absolutely spit out a good 5-10 feet. If the stream isn't powerful and laser-like precise coming out of the jet, then the jet isn't zestfully clean.....

BTW, when using the spray-stream method of checking the jet, don't even THINK of putting your eye or face anywhere even NEAR the jet outflow path, unless you like a painful and potentially serious trip to the emergency room.

 

That's the Starter Circuit Fuel Bowl Metering Jet. Clogged ain't good. You need to Clear that out ... so that when you hit that hole inside the Fuel Bowl with a direct shot of Carb Cleaner from the tube applicator ... is shoots OUT of the back well in a tight stream.

That's one part of the Start Circuit.
The Brass Tube on the Carb Body that extends down into that well ... THAT's the Starter Jet.
There is a Metering Port on the end and sometimes alond the sides of that Tube.

Flush-out the Well, the Tube and "Back Flush" the Tube from the Enrichment Valve position ... if they are still out.

Use a Tip cleaning Tool and probe the Brass Tube. That Siphon Tube is the HEART of Cold Start!

 

so with the fuel bowl metering jet clogged, would that cause the problem that I been having with the bike not starting cold?

 

Yes, absolutely!

 

EUREKA!

 

"Duh"

Yes. In a big way. No Fuel Supply to the Enrichment Valves means trying to start a dead cold bike would be an adventure.

Once you get Fuel Bowl Lower Jet unclogged. Probe the Brass tube with a tool and fill the Booger Sucker with Carb Cleaner and slip the rubber tipped end over the Brass Tube and squeeze ... flushing any crap out the top end.

Then squeeze and let-go like you are clearing-out a clogged toilet.
You want fuel to be able to go up that Brass Tube and into the Enrichment Circuit without a struggle.

When you get that all Cleaned ... your hard cold starting days are over.

 

I cleaned my clogged starter jets with a wire from a wire brush.
I had to thin the wire down with a rotary tool and sharpening stone to make it as thin as a hair.

 

You could have bought a set of tools that would be the right size at a Hardware Store.
Welder's Tip Cleaners do the job nice and only cost a few bucks for the set that has tools that fit all the Jets.

 

I know about the siphon tube, but what is this metering jet in the bowl? I dont remember seeing this on my Mikunis. Is this just a Hitachi thing? Pics?

 

ll my jets are un clogged, I whittled down the red straw thing so it fit in the metering port in the bowl very tightly, and blasted all the junk out. it took a few squirts but I got it all out now it shoots a fine stream about 8 feet from me through the jet, and I can see light through it. I have the carbs all back together on the top side, I'm stopping there until I get new gaskets and new jets. And I really would like to do something about the stuck drain screws while I have the bowls off. And I still have to bench sync them, which is no big deal.

Oh, all my mixture screws were set at different lengths, one was 3 turns out one was 3 and half and one was 4 and forgot the other one. I re set them all to 2 and a half, so lets see what happens. My mixture screws must have been upgraded, they are stainless steel instead of brass.

 

Now they are truly "zestfully clean"......!

 

When you get those new gaskets ... use sealant and SEAL the Gasket to the Bowl.
Then ... lightly Oil the Mating surfaces of the Gasket sealed to the Bowl and the Bottom of the Carb Body.

The Oil will allow the Gasket to form nicely on the ridge thats on the Carb Body ... and, will make a Non-stick surface allowing you to remove the Bowls in the future without harming the Gasket.

I use Marvel Mystery Oil for this process. It's light, does a great job and smells great; too!

 

Rick, you aren't related to Tackleberry are you? Hoppes #9 was his cologne as I recall.