Gonna get more carb removal and install experience

I finished cleaning my carbs and went about the difficult task of getting them back in. After struggling for about an hour I decided there was no way they were going in without pushing the boots back into the air box. I then put a ratchet strap around the air box and behind the shocks and pulled the air box back as far as it would go. That worked fine. Got the carbs in and connected to the engine. Now to get those d@*@#) boots out and mounted to the carbs. Another couple hours work, language that would make a sailor blush and some WD40 to make things slide together better and everything was back in place .......Oh NOOOOOO @#$%^&*( except for that metal shield that I forgot to put back on the carbs. Can't see any way to get it back on while the carbs are on the bike. Tomorrow I start all over again.

 

it has been stated that the shield is not needed.
to me it is more for gathering gas when overflowing and sending to the sides.

the more you remove and replace the carbs the quicker it becomes.

 

Heat the boots with a hairdryer next time. The carbs will (almost) pop right in.

 

Oops! guess I'm still in trouble. No women in this household and my hair is far to sparse to require that implement. lol Actually I didn't have a lot of trouble getting the carb into the intake boots. I had more problems getting the boots from the airbox back out again and onto the carbs. I'll try heating them up a bit next time. For now I think I'll take XJ550H's first comment to heart and see if I can get it running without the shield. If it has other problems then I'll pull it off again.

 

Next time you take the carbs off, get a girl friend with a hair dryer. When you get the carbs back on, Dump her.

 

Buying a heat gun or hair dryer of your own would cost less in the long run.

 

her set of hands would be useful to install the carbs

 

Let's keep it clean here guys

 

I expected help with my technical problems, but love life advice was an added perk.....I think.

 

I have two tools that I use, one is a cheap #2 Phillips screwdriver that is ground round but still has some ridges showing and no burrs . This pushes the boots around without pokeing a hole.
The other is made from 1/8 inch music wire. A 3/8 or1/2 inch 90 on one end and a 3 inch handle bent on the other end. The whole thing is about 6 or 7 inches long.
That will flip the boots over the carb throats.
It still ain't easy.

 

Even new boots don't make it easy. Easier, yes; but not easy.

 

I hooked up my aux gas container yesterday and sure enough the gas just runs right through the carbs. So I'm ordering new needle and seat valves and back off come the carbs. I do have a heat gun so that will be one of the suggestions I try. The other will be the L-shaped tool that someone described on the airbox side.

 

SO...... to the new people. Don't just clean your carbs. Rebuild them. Assume that they have never been touched by anyone who knows what they are doing.
Bench test the float needles before reinstalling the carbs (you really should do this anyway since the fuel levels need to be at least confirmed to be correct, if not set).

 

I was waiting for the double entendre.

 

Got the new float valves installed and as K-Moe so wisely suggested I tested them before putting the carbs back into the bike. Good thing I did as one was not sealing properly. Cleaned up the seat but didn't really see what was causing it to leak. Blew it out with compressed air and put it back together and now it seals properly. Put the carbs in the bike, hooked up the Aux gas container, hit the key and it tried to start. Then it wouldn't even turn over. Turns out the Safety Relay is not sending 12v to the starter solenoid. Not only is the starter not working (unless I hit it with a jumper) but there is no spark. So I looked at "The Best Wiring Diagram of All Time" and when you hover over the safety relay it says to disconnect it to bypass the safety features. So I did, but that makes absolutely no difference. Is that wiring diagram not good for my xj550J model?

 

http://www.xjbikes.com/forums/threads/electrical-problem.94407/
"The Best Wiring Diagram of All Time" works for the maxim the differances in the seca and maxim is a volt meter circuit , a fuel guage circuit, and how the directionals work seca has 2 indicator lights and both hook up to ground . The maxim has 1 indicator light and grounds through the directional bulb that is not being used.
right turn indicator buld grounds through the left bulb.

side stand relay will over ride the starter safety relay, if the sidestand relay is defective or overridden by side stand switch. the clutch safety switch can also override the starter relay
starter safety relay can be overridden by putting a jumper across the red/white wires in the connector.
starter safety relay supplies power to solenoid the solinoid circuit is completed to ground by the starter button Test the button from battery ground to blue wire on soleniod for continuity when the button is pressed. the starter button also controls the oil light test
does the oil light come on when you press the starter button?

There is a 4 position connector near the ignition coils black in color check it for proper connection
it is for the run switch and wires to starter switch. you have to remove gas tank.



disconnect the black /white wire at the tci unit then try to start bike.


it could be you have the wrong relay in the starter connector. ID them all first
The Ultimate Relay, Switch, Sensor, and Diodes Guide
XJ550 models:

Flasher: on a tabbed bracket at the rear of the ignition coils rear mounting bracket.
Flasher canceller: behind ignition coils.
Starter motor solenoid/relay: behind the right side cover, behind the access panel, below the regulator.
Starter/Ignition cut-off relay (no color): front of coil rear mounting bracket.
Sidestand (kickstand) relay (blue): left side, behind rear frame cross tube.
Headlight relay (yellow): behind ignition coils, behind flasher canceller.
Diode block: inside the headlight housing.
Neutral switch: located inside the engine shifter case side cover.

then do this
have you ohmed out the ignition system?
pick up coils
ignition coils primary and secondary
spark plug caps?

XJ550 models:
Pick-up coils:
650 ohms +/- 20% = 520 ohms to 780 ohms acceptable range
Ignition Coils:
Primary side (input from main wiring harness):
2.5 ohms +/- 10% = 2.25 ohms - 2.75 ohms acceptable range

Secondary side (spark plug wires, without their end caps):
11K ohms +/- 20% = 8,800 ohms - 13,200 ohms acceptable range
Spark plug caps:
10K +/- 20% = 8,000 to 12,000 ohms per cap acceptable range

Spark plugs:
0 ohms per plug

to test pick up coils remove left connector from tci
looking for 650 ohms
test ohms from black wire to orange wire
test ohms from black wire to gray wire
test ALL wires to ground


photo shows wires on right

test ignition coil primary from right connector
looking for 2.5 ohms
if out of spec test at connector at ignition coils you have to remove gas tank
RED/white to orange
RED/white to gray


plug tci connectors in and see if you have 12 volts to red wire with key on

Diode block Test xj 550
set meter to diode test for first 3 and ohms for last test

Lt blue .545 yellow
white .543 white/green
green .545 blue/white
green 8.4 ohms black/red

black meter wire red meter wire
post your results

 

Once I got on the correct start circuit cutoff relay things started moving along. Looking at the diagram again, I said to myself; "It's the one under the coil, dummy". One of the pins on the connector was corroded. I scraped it down and reconnected it and now the starter works and I have spark. I finally got it to start and it ran for a while but won't idle. Found that the Tach doesn't work so one more thing to add to the list. Gonna go pick up a set of plugs. The originals don't look bad, but since I know there isn't any major problems I'll invest a few more $. Up to this point the possibility existed that it would become a parts bike.

 

Looks like the carbs are coming off again. It will start and run for a short time, but as it dies it is like it is running out of gas. Is the "Level Guage Adapter" mentioned in the manual
still available or is there a suitable work-around.

 

Chacal sells a fitting that allows tubing to be hooked up to the flot bowl drains.

 

The carbs have been cleaned and the float valves replaced. I received the adapters and hoses from CHACAL and the floats have been set. I set the idle misture screws at 1.5 turns up from bottom. The bike won't start on gas but if I spray some carb cleaner in the airbox side the bike will start and then run at higher RPM on gas. (Not sure what RPM because I need a new tach cable.). When I release the throttle it immediately dies. When I spray carb cleaner on the intake boots the RPM increases on 3 and 4 so either the boots or the gasket will have to be replaced. I see a set of 4 boots with gaskets on ebay for $89 and Bike Bandit has OEM ones for about $70 each. First question: Has anyone purchased the set from GEORGEFIX on ebay and are they good? Second question: Will not having the air box hooked up make a big enough difference to keep it from running? Third question: What am I missing?

 

Are the idle mixture screws coarse threaded or fine threaded?

The course thread screws are set to 1.5 turns out, but the fine thread screws (which are more common) need to be set to 2.5 turns out.

Not having the airbox on won't keep it from starting, but you can't do a final tune on the idle mixture correctly without it.

 

I actually tried it in several positions from 1 turn out to 2.5 turns out. Doesn't seem to make a difference.

 

Are you using the choke when trying to start it?
Did you make sure to clean the enrichment jets in the float bowls?

 

You're talking about the small brass tube with the tiny hole in it I assume. You know I didn't run anything through the hole. I did put the carb cleaner tube on it and tried to squirt some cleaner in it then used compressed air. I was hesitant to mess with the choke/enrichment plungers as they didn't want to come apart and I didn't want to break anything. I'll get me an old E string when I replace the inlet boots and gaskets. Going on a 4K mile trip in July and won't have money to do the boots 'til I get back. Got to spend a few bucks getting the old K1200 Beemer land yacht ready to go.

 

The enrichemnt jets are in the float bowl, at the bottom of the hole that the brass enrichment tube fits into. The jets are pressed in, and take a bit of a u-turn, so they can be a bit difficult to clean. The rest of the enrichment passage can only be cleaned with the enrichment plungers lifted, or removed.

Clean and degrease the intake boots. Then scuff the outsides up with a wire brush, wipe them down again with denatured alcohol. Cover them with oil-resistant black RTV, using a wetted, gloved finger to smooth the RTV. You now have intake boots that won't leak. This can be considered a permanant repair, but I would still replace the intake boots some winter in the future.

 

You also need to do a running sync....

But, if you haven't checked/adjusted valve clearances, you'll end up syncing and color tuning all over again after clearances

 

My credit card won't like it, but I went ahead and ordered a set of new carb boots. They should be here in a couple days. In the meantime I'll see if I can find those enrichment jets in the float bowls that K-Moe pointed me at. On a positive note, I forgot to turn off the gas on my hanging aux gas tank and over the course of 2 days no gas leaked through the float valves.

 

You'll only find the enrichment jets in the bowl---- IN THE BOWL. They are fixed in there. You won't replace them, you won't remove them, and you won't find any to install.

You clean them out. The only other thing to do is drill them ( I highly DON'T recommend doing that.....).

Therefore, the next best thing, as far as I'm concerned, is get a replacement bowl.

But, of all the carbs I've serviced, I've had to replace ONE bowl. It just takes time and patience.

Dave Fox

 

Ok, I got the new boots and have them installed. So looking at the enrichment valves etc. Here is what I have. (See Pictures) I'm assuming that these two holes should be connected somehow. When I stick the little tube from the carb cleaner in hole A and pull the trigger I should see some activity in hole B, Correct? Picture two shows the enrichment penis that goes into hole B and can I assume it sucks up gas that has entered hole A from the float bowl? None of the bowls show any connection at all between A and B so I guessing that's a problem, right.

 

You are correct. Hole A is the enrichment jet. B is the other end of that passage, and C is where the fuel gets drawn up into the carb body.

Thin stiff wire or sewing needle (careful to not enlarge the jet) and/or a soak in Berryman's Chem Dip will usually clear the jet and passage.

 

I soaked them for a couple hours in NAPA carb cleaner. (The stuff that comes in a gallon can with a strainer for the small parts) Haven't ever seen Berryman's, but I imagine this is similar. One of the three jets opened up, so I guess I'll leave them overnight. I worry about that stuff eating the aluminum. I had something similar that ruined a couple Corvair carbs for me many years ago. That could have been Berryman's for all I know. But then again it may have been a dumb shade tree mechanic leaving them in too long.

 

Don't leave them in for more than a few hours (as in 3).
You can repeat the dip if needed.

 

Nobody? Really?
Ok. I'll be quiet then.

 

That is one correct term for something that goes into a hole.

 

jack, if you stick the carb spray tube in A, you should get a stream spraying out of B. If the jet is clear, it will be a needle-thin stream that will easily shoot 8-10 ft or more. Do NOT BR LOOKING STRAIGHT AT I when you spray, or it WILL shoot right in your eye.

If you don't get a stream like that, your jet isn't clear.

Dip.... I use the Napa can of dip--- love it. I'll leave things over night if needed-- then spray with carb/throttle body cleaner m, then compressed air, then dry. Repeat as needed.

You'll get there.... Just be persistent, but don't get impatient or frustrated

 

I did leave it overnight and two more came clean. Still got one stubborn one. Back in the can while I take a trip up to Madison today on the Beemer. There was absolutely no etching of the aluminum so I suspect the Napa stuff is not as strong as the Berryman's.
I learned my lesson with the spray. The little tube from the carb cleaner spray fits nicely in the A-hole and lucky for me I wear glasses. It wasn't a direct shot, but some splatter hit my glasses.
I'm not really in a big hurry, I've got three other licensed bikes to ride. I would like to see this thing run though before winter because I don't have a heated place to work on it. I guess I could always bring it in to the parlor (150 year old house) since I'm without female oversight.

 

I've had carb bodies stay in up to three days if needed..... No issues

 

Good to know. Berryman's will etch aluminum after a few hours.

 

Say what now!?

 

I left carbs in gunk carb dip overnight and I don't think that it caused any issues, would the etching leave any noticeable effects? I did notice that the throttle control linkages are no longer brass colored, but silver.

 

You'll probably also notice that the carb bodies are duller (unless you didn'r clean the crud off of them before the dip, in which case they might actually look brighter, but not a s bright as they should).

The throttle control linkages probably had fuel residue on them. They are supposed to be silver in color.

 

Left the last one in for another 6 hours and now all four enrichment jets are clear. With the new boots installed and the enrichment jets clear I'll put her back together tomorrow and see what happens. What is a good starting point for the gap at the bottom of the butterfly valve. I know they should all be the same, (Bench sync) but not sure how big the gap should be.

 

Some use a paperclip, some use a business card or something similar.

 

Or the hole above the butterfly? Didn't see what carbs or being worked on.

 

Using the idle fuel exit hole as a guide is really best, but all they need to be is even. Paperclip, strips of business card; both are good to use as indexes.

 

Well, I thought I was ready to put it back together. BUT,,,,,,,,,, I tried adjusting the Idle Screw and found that with the screw all the way in the butterfly is still closed. I would like to think that Yamaha would have designed it so that the approximate correct idle speed would be achieved at a mid-point in the adjustment. The threaded portion of my idle screw is approximately 24.5 mm, does that sound right?

 

I took the Idle screw from a set of carbs from a 86 MaximX which looked to be exactly the same but seems to open the butterfly just a tad more. Set the other carbs the same, plugged the carbs back into the intake boots and she now starts right up with the choke on....PROGRESS... Problem----It will run somewhat smoothly as long as I keep the RPM over 3000. Less than that and she dies. I tried the pilot screws at 1.5 and 2.5 up from lock but it doesn't seem to make much difference. Going to hook up the old Mercury based carb synchronizer that I bought for my Corvair many years ago and see what it says.

 

probably one of the butterflies is closed keeping the idle screw from reaching the tang on #3.
when you put the carb sticks on you'll find it

 

The carbs all read about the same now, but the engine still will not run below 3k. The choke is working perfectly so at least I've made progress. Going to search the forum for won't idle and see what I can find.

 

And what I found is "Throttle Shaft Seals". I'm an old dog, but I'm still learning new tricks. Off come the carbs again.