Ugh....carb woes

I have researched and read soooo much about carbs recently that i'm beginning to dream about them (nightmares actually).

I have the 82 xj650 seca with HSC32 carbs.

I've taken them down, cleaned them and now is time to re-assemble with all new parts.
I've looked on fleabay and I see kits with half the parts or, all the parts, but not the jets or 2 jets per carb but no new bowl screws.
I would think that as much as this particular carb is rebuilt, someone would sell a comprehensive kit that rebuilds all the carbs top to bottom. WTF?
Is there such a kit that includes everything I need, even the 6 jets/carb?
I need:
#110
#40
#205 or #195
#50
#36 2per carb

Your help is greatly appreciated, especially because I have 3 of these bikes and I want to rebuild all 3 racks.

Also, while I have you here. I noticed the fuel bowls have a tiny hole in the bottom that goes into the wall of the bowl and up (something to do with cold start or something?) Many posts that i've read say that these like to clog. In my quest to clean them out, I noticed that the holes have varying degrees of sizing. Are they factory jetted with different sizes? All are clear but some pass fluid more than others.
Thanks again!

 

Those holes may look like different sizes but may be due to varying cleanliness.

 

I feel your pain.
When at all possible, I have re used all brass parts from the 2 carb sets I have rebuilt.
First carb, someone up sized the main fuel jets and the pilot air jets were from a different model year (hind sight, I could have left it). But I purchased jets from XJ4ever (they are not cheap) to bring it to factory spec.
I actually broke some jets from carb rebuild #2 and found some "random spare carb parts" on ebay to make up the difference.

Many of the carb rebuild kits have parts that dont' really fit well (threads). Needles and emulsion tubes and all the jets that are correct, I just cleaned and reused.

Watch the Mezmo engineering videos for the carbs. The jets on the fuel bowl are hard inserted. If you get different flow , then likely still need more cleaning. Soak in carb cleaner, then spray it out. (wear glasses as it can come back up to your eyes). I used a set of thin picks to clean them out but be careful not to break them, you will not likely get them out. chemical/heat is better.

There is also a passage from the pilot jets through to the idle mixture screw that then comes out multiple holes inside the carb body by where the butterfly valve is. if that is not clear (mine were clogged) then the fuel enrichment will not work for that carb.

One big thing is the float needle and the needle housing. Carb kits come with different sized ones that won't allow the original filter screens to fit onto them. Better to use the original needle housing and clean the original filter screens, then use a new needle (that has a rubber tip).

Sorry, but I personally dont' like the xj4ever float needle, nor the housing with the built in flat filter (filter should be a half bowl like the original or it can trap debris and obstruct flow).
His bowl gasket, fuel/air jets however are superb.

 

I second reusing the jets and needles. Kits for these carbs are hit or miss. The kit I bought had the wrong size needle (it was larger and would bind), wrong threads on the mixture screws and crappy rubber bowl gaskets that interfered with the floats. The only parts I would replace sight unseen are the float needles and bowl gasket. The enrichment circuit ports in the bowls were the biggest pita when I redid my carbs, literally had to fill the bowls with solvent and let sit overnight then use a fine wire to finally open them up.

 

I'm surprised to hear about the ports on the float bowl for the choke not being restricted in size at the factory. So they are all the same size?
That's good since I accidentally mixed them up.
I used my ultrasonic cleaner on those bowls and washed them 2x for 30min then allowed them to sit in the solution overnight, then ran them again for another 30min cycle. Afterwards, I used the carb cleaning wires and sprayed carb cleaner like mezzmo does. One flows freely then the other 3 have varying degrees of flow. I guess I need to soak em some more.

With regard to the brass parts, I guess I'll just reuse what I can. Someone has been in this carb before and the heads on some of the jets are chewed up. I just thought it'd be nice to find a complete NEW set of guts. After ultrasonic cleaning, i'd really like to have everything new and shiny inside AND out.

Are the fuel filters in the bowl suppose to be flat or rounded? Mine are flat.

Thanks for the posts so far!

 

when you say flow different? are you shooting carb spray down and they are noticeably different?
There is a small brass donut shoved into each bowl controlling the inner diameter of the passage, its visible if you have enough light

 

Yes, exactly! The brass donut all the way down in the bottom. Are all 4 the same size or different from bowl to bowl? If so, this would explain the varying flow from each one.
I spray the carb cleaner into the hole inside the bowl and it passes through and out the top. One passes a bunch, then the next less, then the next, even less and so on.

 

Yes all are the same size in the bottom of the floats and are "KEY" to having you cycle start and run good. So make sure you take the time to get them good and clean. I use a bread toe wire and remove the insulation off the wire. Compressed are, some B12 chemtool and it will come clean.

Just make sure you take your time with the carbs, it is so important to get them right the first time before you put them back in the bike. I would even go as far at doing a wet fit test on a bench or in a vice to make sure the floats are the correct setting and that the carbs are not leaking. Make sure that the carbs are level and flush on a table or in a vice if you chose to do a wet test.

 

All great suggestions!
Just so we're on the same page, these are the holes I'm talking about.

 

I've rebuilt four sets of the carbs , bought the butterfly seals from xj4ever and used a rebuild kit from China from eBay.

 

Yea, I have no problem with sourcing the parts from china (if I have to) but my gripe is, this is a common carb and there are no comprehensive rebuild kits. You can piecemeal them together but, by the time you're done, its super expensive. IF you can manage to find everything.

 

Well, of course it depends on what you mean by "comprehensive".....as others have pointed out, for most typical rebuilds you do not need:

- fuel and air jets (all 6 of them)
- main jet needles
- emulsion tubes a/k/a main jet
- floats and their pins
- vacuum pistons
- choke plunger valves
- mixture screws
- most hardware


which is why you don't see kits that have all those parts.....basically, with the costs of all of the precision machined brass parts, it would drives the cost of a kit way up (rubber is cheaper to mold/produce than brass is to machine).

We actually do have "everything" (except the vacuum pistons, but we do have replacement diaphrams for them), but, as noted, it gets expensive. And all of the parts that we offer are either made domestically, or are made in Japan or Taiwan, who tend to be the closest to OEM-quality that you'll find......with Chinese parts, it's hit-or-miss on quality, as the precise tolerances needed on many parts requires both the proper type of equipment as well as proper machine maintenance and operation of such equipment (which, truth be told, is where many of the China manufacturers fall down......most have the latest/greatest machining centers, etc., but they just don't know....or fail to realize the importance of.....properly maintaining such equipment, and properly training the operators on the use of such equipment). So you end up with precision equipment precisely and efficiently spitting out imprecise, off-spec parts that are cheap in price, and cheaper in "quality". There are lots of "shortcuts" that can be taken in industrial/commercial production (machining, stamping, molding, etc.) processes.

For example, look on eBay for reproduction intake manifolds.......they're everywhere, and for ridiculously low prices (like $ 30.00 for a set of 4). OEM manifolds can run $ 100.00 or more a piece. Do you think there's any differences? Think the rubber being used might be sub-standard? Will they last 30+ years like the originals, or 3 years? 30 days? We had some of those (by mistake) that we sold, some of them didn't last 3 days. Asked some experts, and they concluded that either the manufacturer was sourcing the cheapest rubber compound possible, or....more likely....that the mill that the manifold manufacturer was sourcing the material from was telling them that they were sending them grade "ABC" rubber compound, but really they were supplying grade "abc" material, which wouldn't vulcanize properly or didn't have the proper characteristics for that type of product or process.

The devil's in the details in complicated manufacturing processes, or as the saying goes, there's 2 kinds of oats you can buy: the ones that you feed to the horse or the ones that come out of the horse.....