Help ... Major electrical issuses

I have a 1980 650 maxim that I am trying to get on the road. I went and got a new battery and charged it up. Stuck it in there and I only get a rear running light. No headlight, turn signals, starter. Nothing but the back running light. If anyone has suggestions or a wirring diagram it would be much appreaciated.
Thanks,
Tiny

 

First thing to do is take a good look at the fuse pane, and replace it with a newer blade fuse panel (Chacal sells them) you really need to do that.

Second, pull any connectors you can find... clean them and add some anti-ox connector goop.

 

Finished that this morning. Still no luck.

 

It's set up so the headlight won't come on until the motorcycle starts, so ignore that for the time being.

You need to get out your multimeter or test light and the wiring diagram and start checking things out.

 

Figured out the issue. The contacts in the key switch were severly corroded. Penitrating oil and electrical grease solved it.
Thanks for the advice.

 

glad you fixed it before spring hits.

 

Now I have another issue. No spark! The fuse is good and has power. Could both coils be bad? Also, still no head light. Any thoughts?

 

Tiny, I have the shop manual for our bikes. Give me a call around 9:00 on Thursday morning and we'll see what we can figure out.


Wamaxim

 

Unfortunatly I have to work thursday. I'll test start tracing wires when I get off work and see if it's something simple that wont require the manual. If I get it running I'll have to bring it by sometime this next week. If I don't get it running would friday or saturday work for you?

 

Tiny,

See pm

Wamaxim

 

tiny if you diddn have a manual before here you go - i take no credit for this.
http://www.4shared.com/dir/1570443/a2eb ... aring.html

 

Everything checks out. Im just not getting power to the headlight or spark. I'm really stumped here.

 

UPDATE: There are two wires running to each coil for a total of four wires. All four wires have 12 volts constantly. Should these be on all the time? What tells the coils when to fire?

 

Tiny,

I had somewhat of a similar problem as far as the not starting problem goes. I read that you replaced the fuse pane...my problem was fixed because the 10 amp fuse I had in the ignition block was not making sufficient contact with the terminals. As soon as I replaced that and bent the terminals in it fires right up every time. Just a thought.....

 

I also have the same problem with the headlight, it only comes on when I start the bike, and I haven't been able to figure that one out yet. Let you know if I do though....

 

This is the last time I will say this in this thread:

THE HEADLIGHT ON AN XJ650 MAXIM IS DESIGNED TO NOT TURN ON UNTIL THE MOTORCYCLE IS RUNNING!

 

MiCarl, if you read my last post you will notice that I didn't mention the headlight. I'll worry about after the bike is running if it still doesn't work. I am desperate to figure out why I have no spark. I checked the coils and had about 3.3 ohms. I'm simply at a loss. Everything looks good and has checked out with a test light and dvom. Where would be the first place you guys would look? It has a brand new fully charged battery.

 

3.3 ohms.....assuming that's an accurate measurement.....is way out of spec for those coils. Maybe not in "absolute failure" bad, but still.....way out of spec. Like about 50% too high..........

 

I'll use a different dvom tomorrow and check again. They are probably bad. But I dont trust my ten year old radioshack meter very well. I'll post results as soon as I have them. Thanks chacal.

 

Tiny, are you sure it is 12vdc constant? Most electronic multimeters will miss the pulsing as it is very brief. You need to watch the spark plugs for firing, if they don't spark, you are not getting the field switching needed to get the spark. I'd check out your pickup coils first (should see 650 ohms across them) and see if they are pulsing. Try using the dwell setting on your meter (provided you have that setting) or borrow an analog meter to watch for the tell-tale needle bounce. Your TCI box could be bad (and I know which transistor it is) but go for the easy stuff first.

 

Thanks robert. I checked for spark with a spark tester and have nothing. What is the proper procedure for checking the pickup coils? Is the tci box the box next to the ignitor box? I know these are probably noob questions but thats what I am so please give step by step instructions.
Thanks again,
Tiny

 

Best advice I can offer you at this point Tiny is to get a manual. The Haynes has worked well for me for many years. The XJCD is very cheap and has it all.
Another is to check out this link and read it through.
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Speedway/7795/
On the left side of the bike, under the side cover, you will find two boxes. The finned silver box is the voltage regulator.
The black box with the two connectors plugged into it is the TCI. Unplug the 6 pin connector (the Haynes erroneously lists it as a 4 pin but shows the 6 pin connector picture) and ohm out between the Blue wire and either the Orange or Grey wire. You will need to experiment to determine which blue wire goes with the orange or grey wire. You should see 700 ohms +/- 20% at 20C (560-840 ohms works).

 

When i went to check the tci there was no blue wire, there was black orange gray and brown wires. There was 622 ohms between the black and orange. The coils are showing 2.2 and 2.5 ohms. Is there a way to test the tci?

 

Coils sound like they're good. Here's more than you ever wanted to know about your TCI:

http://www.jetav8r.com/Vision/IgnitionFAQ.html

 

My headlight comes on with the key. <shrug>

 

Then you have a bad headlight relay, or the wrong headlight relay in there! (on some models, the headlight DOES come on with the key!). All models that did NOT use a headlight relay have the light come on with the ignition power (key turned to "ON"):


Headlight Latching Relays:

hlr1) OEM headlight system HEADLIGHT RELAY. This relay prevents the headlight from coming on while the starter motor is being engaged, thus allowing maximum battery voltage to be used by the starter and the ignition system. However, it is dependant on voltage draw in order to energize and "latch" into the on position, and thus if the engine gets spinning fast enough during the starting process (whether the engine fires or not), enough voltage will be produced by the alternator (which increases its output with RPM's) to clamp this relay, and thus pass current to the headlamp. Also, once latched on, the headlight circuit remains on until the ignition switch is turned fully off.....thus, if you (for example) stall the bike, and hit the starter button, this relay will remain latched and the headlight WILL remain lit during the starting process. Only by turning the key to the off position can you de-energize this relay (and thus turn the headlight off).

Identification: The Headlight Relay is a small square metal "can" relay, and has a small yellow paint "dot" or yellow locking tab, and has the following 4 wires connected to it:

- XJ550 all models and XJ650 all models except Turbo: a solid black wire, a solid white wire, a blue wire with a black tracer stripe, and a red wire with a yellow tracer stripe.

- XJ750 Seca models: a solid black wire, a white wire with a blue tracer stripe, a blue wire with a black tracer stripe, and a red wire with a yellow tracer stripe.

NOTE: original relays were always a square metal can style, although they may have been replaced by an automotive style plastic relay.


HCP429 OEM main HEADLIGHT RELAY. For all XJ550, XJ650 (except Turbo), and XJ750 Seca models.
$ 79.95

 

Hm, that's interesting...I just figured it was like that because the bike was older. Thanks as always for the info.

 

SO the cdi that came with my bike is shot. The one on my parts bike is shot. The one off the 700 is different and wont work. Im not sure if it is worth going on, this bike has me frustrated beyond all reason and I've sunk most all my money into it at this point. I'll try to order a cdi off ebay and see what happens but at this point I cant even look at the thing. I don't mind the work but the money involved is getting to be too much.

 

Tiny, send me your dead TCI. I can look it over and test it for you (for the cost of shipping and parts, I'll fix it). I've got a few known good units and have repaired a few of them. We might get yours up and happy again.

 

Robert, that would be absolutly amazing. Pm me with information to send it to you and an estimate of parts cost and let me know what you want for your services. You absolutly made my day.
Thanks,
Tiny

 

I've got a TCI on my desk - I never used it but I was sold it by another XJ'er

Details:
Type TID14-06
5G2-10
Stamped on it is 111
Hitachi

I suspect it is for a 650 as that is what I owned... for the cost of shipping and a nod of the hat someone will probably enjoy it more than I.

 

woot: see pm

 

best thing i found was start ripping wires out untill its fixed haha truely that worked and i managed to eliminate a ****load of wires that had no purpose

***Edited by Robert. Mind the language please. Thanks!***

 

Tempting. But if I were to go for a destructive method I would say some special fourth of july stuff from the indian reservation would make all my problems go away.

 

haha if thats wot floats ya boat i actually found it really interesting that so many wires done nothing my build this winter i reckon i could just about limit my xj to ummmm say ten wires in total

 

Yeah, there sure are alot of wires for four fuses. I plan on making a harness this next winter eliminating alot of garbage and adding more protection. The ignition system on this thing is alot more complex then the old dt1 I've been working on. I'm almost to the point of putting the old dt on the road but I've come to far to half ass the restoration now.

 

yeah well im doin away with most of the original stuff no dash etc just a speedo with two lites one for high beam one for neutral the rest is just junk just changing my starter switch from a xj750p to a 650 took care of 6 wires so its easy really love to see pics of the dt

 

Sounds nice and simple. What speedo are you going with? Pics of the dt will come as soon as I can afford to get a new carb and seat for her. I am learning that these old yamaha require more patience than I knew I had. All my freinds are saying junk it and go get a newish bike but nothing I can afford has close to the style of these old maxims. And with chacal around getting parts isn't as big of a deal as I expected (if only he had stuff for the old dt). Which reminds me, as soon as the maxim runs chacal had better be ready for a big order so I can bring her back to her former glory. Now for a name for the old girl.

 

looked at a few old yammie bits im not sure wot im gunna use yet but i will keep the forum posted during build over winter as for having the dollars well i think we are all in the same boat there u r lucky you got chacal there i wished we had somehere here that had the parts he's got mind u these bikes are pretty scarce here

 

Hey Zealand, I ship worldwide! So you "got me there", too.....

 

yeah mate i priced a neutral switch up and with freight i think it ended up being about $90nz a yamaha dealer charged me $65nz still expensive though i think you were $15.95us from memory which worked out to be about $30nz just for that so the freights a killer

 

Notfy07,

If you'll look upthread, there is a post from MiCarl with big bold red letters which states that the headlight will NOT come on until the bike starts. That is how it is made so that the headlamp is not pulling current needed to start the bike.

 

Doh! never mind ... I was at the bottom of page 1 and didn't see that there were more pages ...

 

Clean the battery ends and make sure you clean the ground on the engine.

 

Comon guys!
I think I saw about 4 or 5 posts asking why the light won't come on.
No spark = no running motor = NO LIGHT!

The light comes on when the motor STARTS, or at least fires a bit. (Not sure exactly what engages it) But even if you get a few pops and it dies, the light comes on and stays on.
It's a way of allowing more battery/cranking power to the starter without draining juice with the headlight.

 

UPDATE, I'm finally done being frustrated by this bike. After a couple weeks away from her I've decided that she will make it onto the road and I will build it from the ground up if I have to. What I need from you guys is a good starting point for no spark. The coils ohm out ok, my next guess would be to check the pick ups. Any ideas for to go about doing it? Any other ideas?