XJ/FZ Cafe Project

Hi all, I've been having a look around all the projects on here and you guys are certainly a talented bunch when it comes to your builds.

So, before I start let me introduce my main ride, a 1990 XJ600 in pretty much imaculate condition, this bike I will never sell as I love it's characteristics.


Anyway, on with the project, I got to talking with a guy recently who had a garage full of spares for the XJ and for the princely sum of £10 and a crate of beer, I was the proud owner of a motor, electrics, carbs, and a whole host of other stuff. So it sat in my garage for a year before I realised there was almost enough to build a bike. I just needed a rolling chasis. so here's the plan. XJ frame cos I like old skool round tubes on a bike and the frame rales are wide enough to accomadate the bigger carbs the FZ couldn't.

I decided to go with FZ forks and top yoke (triple clamps) and FZ wheels (16" front 18"rear). The FZ's bottom yoke's stem is far too long to fit, so simple solution was to use the XJ bottom with the FZ top. Job Jobbed.

so we have this mess.

The way I build is to start by doing a "dirty" build, I build as I get parts, once I get what resembles a bike I'll strip 'er down for powder coat and paint.

I now need to get an FZ swing arm, just a case of waiting for one to come up on E-bay at the right price.

Right I gotta warn you guys, This is probably gonna take a long time to build, but I will put up progress pics and add some info when I can.

 

I had to sell a few bits and peices in order to fund the frame, forks wheels and yokes.
Like I mentioned I am just waiting on a suitable swinger coming up for sale before I can continue the Dirty.

So to amuse myself, I spent a couple of hours freeing off and cleaning up this here master cylinder,

next will be the carbs, but I know they are in good working order, cos I tried them on my XJ!

anyway, more as it happens

 

Welcome kevw, I'm new as well. Recently came across a 1984 FJ600 that I was going to part out then had a change of heart. If the dirty bike comes out half as good as your other one you'll have a couple of fine rides there.

 

Cool bike, sir!

And holy cow, I would love to have your lower front fairing for my Seca

 

I have a swinger, shock and bits from a 1988 FZ600, to bad shipping would be a nightmare.

 

Thanks guys!
Hey Raven, Ebay uk or Ebay europe have these cowls on from time to time, standard fit on a euro xj600

Thrasher, I'd love to come and pick 'em up :lol:

I spent a few weeks in the U.S. a few years ago and absolutely love it. mmmmm happy days.

ah well I have just got the scottish highland roads to play with!!!!!

 

Check out this post and note where tiff lives - he may have a standard xj swing arm.

http://www.xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic ... =tiff.html

You must ride past each other!

 

Probably do markie, probably do

It's not an XJ swinger I am looking for though. It's the FZ one!!!

Such are these "bitsa" projects!

 

Interesting project.. Are the FZ parts a straight swap or is there some "jobbing" to be done?

 

I'm curious about that as well. Seems like there should be a lot of "like" components but what year range is most equivalent? And as far as exhaust goes, will 4-1 for a FZ or XJ bolt up to a FJ? Lot more part options when you throw the XJ and FZ into the mix.

 

Haynes workshop manual covers the fj/xj and FZ together.

It's only the air cooled FZ which shares the same engine with the XJ. I believe up until about 1988 in the UK. The FZ carbs are smaller diameter - maybe to accomodate the more sporting body of the FZ?

There are size differences like wheels and the swing arms and suspension linkages are different although "Similar".

I reckon it would be a case of offering things up and adapting them.

Kevw is in the best position!

 

Hey guys!


The FZ and The XJ 600 share the same engine.
Quick history, The XJ600 was Yam's mid weight Sports bike in the early 80's.....and then Honda brought out the CBR600. This left Yamaha lagging so they took their Japan only FZ400 and crammed the 600 motor into it. The FZ600 was a stop gap until Yamaha could develop the FZR600 Genesis. Now because the FZ's frame was meant for a 400 30mm carbs were fitted to the 600 as the 32's just physically can't get in the space.
So ironicaly the new FZ sports bike had smaller carbs and less agressive cams, my plan is to use the best of both worlds and have a light weight "full power" XJ

As for parts fitting, at the moment I am just testing to see what fits. and so far I can tell you, the FZ steering stem is waaaaay to long so I've used an XJ bottom yoke with the FZ top.

The FZ forks are the same length as the xj's and both are 32mm diameter, but the wheel spindle is a smaller diameter, which means you can't stick an FZ front wheel straight on an XJ. the discs and calipers are identical on the front. Reason for using FZ forks? So I can use the FZ wheels, which carry slightly wider rubber, and because they are "stiffer" than the XJ ( I am building to a tight budget so am not really concidering trying to fit more exotic stuff)

The front wheel is 16" instead of 18", this suits me fine as this should incourage faster steering.

And finaly, I have measured the swing arms and they seem to have the same dimensions, so the FZ arm should fit in the frame without too much hassle.

(Oh and I amy have sourced the parts I need to complete my rolling chassis!)

More soon guys!

 

oh, I forgot to add, the FJ600 is the same bike as the XJ600

1984-1985 in the USA and 1984-1992 in the UK I believe

the FZ ran from 86 - 88 in the uk at least. and should not be confused with the later FZ6 Fazer.

exhausts for each are interchangable (although the FZ's may need a little fettling to fit the XJ!)

 

quick update, still waiting for the parts I need to become available, so I have spent my time cleaning up some parts.

I know I said I was doing a "Dirty" build, but some parts should be cleaned up before fitting.

So here's a pic of the carbs before and after cleaning. I seperated them out and cleaned them in my parts washer. also making an apearance are the brake torque arm and the fork brace.

Boring I know, but at least its a little bit of progress!!!!

 

you've got a wild hair!

 

no idea what you mean, but thanks! :lol:

 

good day,

projects looking good. i have an 86 fz600 track bike.

the 32 mm FJ (XJ)carbs don't fit the fz because of the frame/airbox clearance. i am installing 32mm fj carbs on the fz with pods. pods are the only way to fit the larger 32mm carbs. i will be using a dynojet stage 3 jet kit (stage 3 is for fj600 with pods and 4-1).

here in canada the only difference between the fj and fz engines are the carbs - 32mm vs 30mm. cams and timing are identical.
the forks in canada are 36mm (on both bikes).
cheers

 

Yup my mistake, the forks are 36mm.
was cheking the specs, and the uk XJ has a larger exhaust cam than the FZ, but the US FJ uses the same cams as the FZ.

Also the UK XJ uses a larger pilot jet than the FZ or FJ.

weird stuff.

 

Thats a very clean XJ Kev! I'll be watching this project with interest! Nice one

 

I'm looking at using another inlet cam on the exhaust side, it's a common mod in the late GSXR1000 and gives more lift (not sure on duration)

 

not a bad idea.

(althoug I think I'll get this thang built before I start tuning the life out of it)

 

good day,
interesting observation ....i was wondering if you would post up the specifications for the uk exhaust cam. i may go on a hunt for a cheap one if it means HP! hubie.
EDIT: USE AN INTAKE CAM IN PLACE OF THE EXHAUST? very interesting. anyone out there actually done this? i need to do some research on the cam specs. anyone else have any input on the cams?

 

I did that on my SV650 and it worked.

 

I have an FZ600 I got in 87' and an FJ600 I got a few years ago and love them both. The trouble is getting a good 16" tire for the front end of the FZ, 18's are not that easy either though. The carbs from the FJ600 are Mikuni BS32 and the FZ wore Mikuni BS30. The cards should swap if you go to individual cone filters and remove the air box. The main reason the FZ was down a few hp was the frame was designed for the FZ400 sold, at that time only in Japan, and as a result it was not big enough to feed the larger carbs on the other 600. If you do go with the individual cone filters and or the larger carbs you will need to re-jet them. I would not be sure what jet kit to get if the came timing is different between the two but if that does not matter I will tell you the jet sizes and needle settings that I run and you can start there. Good luck.

I have a pic of my FZ in it's current condition.

 

I swapped my XJ forks and front tire for an 86 FZ600 and it handles great!
The front tire that works reallt well for me is the Bridgestone Battlax BT45 sport touring. It has really decent grip and handles rain very well. When I did my swap I just took off the XJ forks, tire and all and replaced with the FZ forks, tire and all. There was no fabrication or "backyard fixes."

 

I've still not managed to get the parts to continue with the build, but I have finished the carbs off! Yamaha cheeped out during production and only put chromed carb tops on the outside carbs, so I took the chrome ones off and swapped them for steel ones on my XJ. So now XJ has 4 chrome carbs and the projects has steel tops, which are now painted black
(this is to tie in with the theme of the bike, more of which later).

I have been having a few problems with my XJ so this has kinda taken up my workshop time.

Boyoboy, I'll find the spec of the u.k. cams and post them up as soon as I can.

Slightlyoffaxis, yeah these bikes are great, very underated these days.
Love your FZ...looks like your quite busy! I will be fitting individual filters to this project (I am not really impressed with the PVC tube mod that some people do) So I will be experimenting with jets and needle clip positions etc.

 

Oh, as for tyres...Bridgestone BT45's front and rear for both bikes.
Reasonable costs, good wear rate and excelent handling characteristics.

 

Does the PVC mod your talking about have to do with the hose that runs from the air box to an opening on the crankcase on the left side, as you sit on the bike?

 

Nah, thats the crankcase breather.

The Pvc mod, uses plastic plumbing tubes to link the carb intakes and has a cone filter sticking out the side of the bike. It's detailed elsewhere on this site. personaly I think it's a pretty nasty modifaction.

 

do you mean nasty as a good thing?

 

It doesn't have to come out the side, on my FJ it comes out the back and there is just enough room for the battery to be tucked behind it. Battery has to be turned 90 degrees and the other electronic have to be rearranged a bit.

 

Delete

 

That looks verry restrictive, for a four cylinder motor getting air via one small filter.

 

There are two on this set-up...just hard to see. Here's another pic. Still testing but plugs have been looking pretty good.

 

FJbell, Is there any benefit over the airbox on the FJ?
I don't see the point on my XJ as the airbox was designed with the bike, and works well with the standard jetting.
Without meaning any offence, unless the original airbox is unavailable I can't see the point in this mod.
If it were a performance thing I would go with four individual filters, and a carefull carb set up.
Although I must admit that your setup is a bit more elegant than most.

Of course I may be incredably wrong about this........

 

Well I have a swingarm and all the parts ordered I need to complete the rolling chassis. should be here about thursday. will post pics when I get them!

 

I think FJbells airbox was missing from the word go - hence the need to do something else!

 

In the case of a missing airbox, and with the original being pretty scarce in the US, I would probably do the same thing......

 

Yes, airbox was long gone, bike was in a field and had been left for dead. Not sure if the pvc plumbing is going to be permanent, but I needed something to restrict the airflow so that the BS32's would idle and run half way decent. Still trying to work out some title issues before I decide what the bike is going to be used for and how much money I'm willing to throw at it. Glad to see we have a few FJ's and older FZ's hanging out here so we can compare notes.

Who knows Kevw, we could be related somehow. My ancestors came over from Scotland to Prince Edward Island 250-300 years ago then some migrated to Minnesota were I was born. Live in Denver now, last name is Bell.

 

You never know!!! My last name is Wilson, but I am decended from the Clan Gunn on my fathers side and Clan Gordon on my Mothers.
(Scottish history is quite complicated!!!!!)

As for your FJ, get it road worthy and see what you think, I must admit, I really like mine, it's quite light, reasonably powerfull and handles well. (and it's damn comfy!!!)

The only issue is you can't buy a decent exhaust for them in the UK. Only a Motad Neta, and they screw up the carbs something awfull!

 

I've taken it around the neighborhood a few times and I agree, they seem to handle pretty well. And since the alternator is tucked behind the head the motor is not nearly as wide as the old KZ's that I have. I should be able to get a title for it but worse case scenario, could be used as a track day bike just for fun.

 

Right I am getting really bored waiting for my new parts to show, so I am going to let you guys in on the theme for this bike.

It's obviously gonna be cafe style, but it aint gonna be black with checks and ace of spades (That refers to the ace cafe in london by the way)

no it's going to be a dark bike with no shiny baubles.

check the following couple of pics and you'll get the idea.

(The bikes not mine. Haven't got a clue whose it is, I stumbled over the pic after looking for inspiration)

 

Quick update for you guys, my swing arm, linkages, sprocket carrier and shock arrived today. All second hand and all pretty horrible. The shock will probably get junked as it looks a little too far gone, but everything else is usable.

Right The FZ600 swing arm slots straight into the XJ600, which is a mighty fine thing. Here's the rub. the shock linkage for the FZ is offset slightly and doesn't fit the xj frame (although the shock lines up perfectly).
An XJ linkage won't work 'cause it is completely different to the FZ's and won't fit with the swing arm. (drop links are much wider on the XJ)

I am a little pi$$ed off just now,(it's 11.25pm and I'm tired!) so I'll put pics up tomorow

I think I am gonna have to visit the machine shop the have the linkage modified and a spacer made.

You will see what I mean when I post up the pics.

On the sunny side though, I am quite stoked that the nice alloy swinger slots right in with no funny buisness.

 

That swingarm sounds pretty sweet, hope you get the shock linkage kinks worked out! What's the difference between the FZ and the FJ swingarm? And how wide is the FZ wheels? What tire size will clear in there?

 

As promised here's a few update pics,

The bits as they arrive



and the arm in the frame





and the linkage thats giving me a headache. at the top of the linkage is the frame link and as you can see it's offset. I need this bang in the centre, so off to the machine shop to see what they can do.
I think they are going to turn down one side and add a spacer to the other to take up the slack. looks like it's gonna cost me about £40 plus tax, I would hazard a guess at $75 all in. but that's what happens when you build a project.
I should get it back a the end of the month. (payday!)



and finally, for SSrat, this is a pic of the standard XJ (FJ) arm, to compare.

I don't know how wide a tyre you can squeeze in there, I am going with standard 120/80/18, why? 'cos I like the look off tall skinny tyres, and this bike is being built to use on very narrow twisty roads. The standard wheels are perfect for this (the front is a 16" instead of 18", but this will speed up steering so I am happy with that!)

 

awesome, can't wait to see the final result.

 

Looking good!

 

Niiiiiice. I'm assuming the FZ swinger is Aluminum, and the FJ's is Steel? That'd look pretty sweet all polished up... not to mention the weight savings! Could you weigh it? I'm going to tear apart my FJ pretty soon (As soon as the 400 is done!) and will weigh the steel swingarm for comparison.

 

Yeah, I am only mocking it up just now, so I'll weigh it when I pull it apart again. If you are going down this route though, remember the FJ's linkage wont fit, neither will the drop links from the fj swing arm. You will have to use FZ drop links, bottom linkage and shock (the bottom of the FZ shock has a fork, the FJ an eye). and you'll have to get the linkage modded as I mentioned above.

I'll let you know how things go.

Oh and Yeah it is Aluminium. and your going to have tu use a FZ rear caliper as well.


Stay tuned folks :lol:

 

Well the shock I got is toast. No damping left whatsoever, Ah well you can't win 'em all!

On the plus side, a shock from an early FZ6 Fazer will fit straight in and are in plentiful supply! So as soon as I get my linkage back from the machine shop I'll get one of these bought and get the rear end fitted up proper.

Once the back end is in, I can get the engine and carbs in, start to think about where my wiring is going to go (will be a scratch built loom) I need to hide all the components away (probably under the tail) cos the bike is going to be pretty open.

Once thats done I can think about styling, tanks, bodywork etc. Shaving the frame of all unnessecary lugs.

Then I'll need to get the whole lot stripped down again for painting.
ah well happy days!