Can't get middle drain plug out. Gas in oil.

Hi all. I am changing the oil and filter in the '85 XJ700 that I bought last week because, in the process of trailering it home (No license yet.), I managed to get gas in the oil.

The problem is that I can't get the middle drain plug out and I don't want to leave in even that small amount of oil given that it is contaminated. So I came in here and did a search for info, only to see that RickCoMatic emphatically states:

"Don't Touch the Middle Gear Drain Plug.
DO NOT ATTEMPT TO REMOVE IT."

I was considering filling the bike with a cheaper grade of oil than the Mobil1 synthetic I bought (It's what the PO used.), running the bike for a few minutes to circulate the oil and distribute the oil from the middle gear area, then draining what I can from the drain plug.

This method will still leave a bit of less contaminated oil in the bike, however, so I was considering repeating the above process with the less expensive oil prior to refilling with the Mobil1. (Lather, rinse, repeat. Right!)

After two times through with new oil, I think the amount of gas remaining in the middle gear area should be diminished to an extent sufficient to be safe for the bike.

Thoughts, ideas, criticisms? Anything would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.
Eric

 

That would be the right idea, but I believe I would use an even cheaper oil. Oil is expesive these days. Dont forget to follow up the fluching with a filter change also.

 

Re: Can't get middle drain plug out. Oil in gas.

Eric:

There is a TOTAL of less than 1/3 of a Cup of Oil to drain out of the Middle Gear.

The bike is NOT engineered to allow tool access to that Plug.
The Plug breaks real easy.

If you break the plug ... you start removing stuff until you get a clean shot at doing complicated repairs.
The whole Exhaust system needs to come down and off; first!

"Don't (F-word) with prosperity."
If you break it ... it will leak ... and, you have the starring role in one lousy bitch of a nightmare.

If you leave it alone and NEVER touch it ... you'll have your oil and filter changed in less than an hour and be riding and having fun.

Leave it.
Don't touch it.
Forget about it.

If anybody trumps what I have to say and encourages you to go-ahead and try ... ask them if they are going to make the trip over to help you fix it ... if it breaks???

Left alone ... the Sun comes up tomorrow and you ride.

If it goes bad ... the Sun rises and you curse and wrench and listen to everybody else riding by!

 

Thanks guys. Looks like I'm off to buy some el cheapo oil to run through this thing.

I had read somewhere, and I think that it was in these forums, that there is as much as a cup and a half of oil in the middle gear. I'm glad to hear that it's as little as a third of a cup. That means even less residual gas will be left after my "Lather, Rinse, Repeat." .

I've gotta say, without this forum I'd be totally trashing this bike. There seems to be very little information available on the '85 and '86 models of the Maxim. Can't even get a Clymer or Haynes manual for it.

Thanks again.

 

Get some 20W/50 in there and go.

If you drained the Crankcase and Oil Filter Housing ... you're fine.

Anything left over is going out the back after the crankcase gases are vented to the airbox and used as fuel.

 

It sounds like you've done your research, but just to be clear ... If fuel has found its way into the crankcase, there's only one reason for that - well two simultaneous reasons actually. It's definitely something to keep your eye on.

Here's a post (and thread) with more details:
http://xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic/p=31525.html#31525

Z

 

Alright RickCoMatic, that's what I'm gonna do. It'll save me a lot of extra work that I didn't need.

WeAreZilla, I don't think that there's anything wrong with the petcock. As the thread you linked to above points out, the PRIME position lets gas flow without vacuum. Well, for some reason, right before I loaded the bike on the trailer, the wife of the guy I bought the bike from (It was her bike.) turned the petcock. I didn't think anything of it at the time because the Honda CB175 I owned 25 years ago had a petcock with an OFF position. I assumed that she was turning the petcock off. When I got the bike home, after much bouncing in the back of the U-Haul trailer, I found a puddle of gas on the floor of the trailer under the airbox vent tube.

After spending much of the last few days reading threads in here I learned that the petcock for the XJ doesn't have an OFF position and when I checked, voila, the petcock was in the PRIME position, allowing gas to freely slosh and drain at every twist and turn in the road.

Let me know if you believe this to be an incorrect conclusion, as I want to fix anything that needs fixing before I take it on the road.

Thanks for all the help.

 

That would be a very good reason for there to be gas in the oil. Sounds like you definately forund the problem. Glad to hear you did the homework and found a very simple answere to the proble. Post up a pic of your bike. How much was the purchase price. I think you will find that the 700 will do you justice on the road. I just got one myself last month and rebuilt a few things. Pics in my gallery.

 

Rasputin:

Where you from?

New England area???

 

Welcome Rasputin. I'm going to invite Rick's ire here and support him as well.
I've run my 650 Max without having pulled the middle drain plug ever! (80K miles and still ticking nicely).
There is not enough volume in the middle sump (as Rick points out, 1/3 cup or so) to warrent your concern. Now if you are the impossibly anal type, you might wish to get the exhaust system out of the way to get direct, unfettered access to the bolt in question but it won't net you a whole heck of a lot for the work involved. I have successfully pulled my middle gear drain plug with the exhaust system in place and what a royal pain it was!!! Nex time you have the motor out of the bike, get yourself a 6-point socket on that bolt and remove it, if nothing else just to clean the threads and reseal them with teflon tape and/or a copper washer for back-up.

 

I'm from Pennsylvania RickCoMatic.

I bought the bike on eBay, samsr. I hedged a bit because it has 27K miles on it, but I bit the bullet and went for the "Buy It Now" option and paid $1500 after the owner assured me it was in great shape. I considered going through the whole bidding process, but I wanted it and I've seen people not do the "Buy It Now" thing and have the item go for even more. It's in nice shape for its age (At least I think it is.), and the PO pampered it, so I took a gamble. This one paid off better than the $621 I paid a month or so ago for an XS650 that I was told wasn't running, but only needed "minor TLC". My son and I call that one "The Rustbucket". IMO, it's going to need to be completely restored, and I'm no mechanic by any stretch of the imagination. I found a link in one of the threads to the online "Motorcycle Repair Course" and I'm going to use "The Rustbucket" as my "project" bike.

Personally, I think the best thing about having bought the XJ700 is finding this forum. (Then again, I haven't ridden the bike yet. )

 

Thanks Robert. No, I no longer have any intention of trying to remove that middle gear drain plug.

That mileage is impressive. Here I thought my 700 had passed the halfway mark in its lifespan and you tell me, "It Ain't So!" It's looking more and more like money well spent.

 

I think you will enjoy the fruits of you labor. 27000 isnt very many miles for one of these bikes. As lon as it is taken care of, it will give you many miles of pleasure and good mileage. I paid 650 for mine but it was a wreck job. It had been run into a mailbox so I am told. Many hours later and a little money, she looks good and runs great. Lots of power and much pleasure. Good luck with your project.
You are correct in finding this forum as well. Great people here and a lot of knowledge. I knew nothing about bikes last year but now I wouldn't be afraid to change my primary chain. Being a mechanic helps too.

 

OK Rasp:

Let's get that 700 Movin'.

What's the list of Pre-flight maintenance needed on that 700 before it goes-up to flight status ... fully operational?

 

The gas in the oil was the only problem RickCoMatic. I'm gonna fill 'er with oil today and then she'll be good to go.

Now the only real problem is a lack of a learner's permit. I went to the DMV yesterday first thing in the morning thinking that the place would be deserted. NOT! The line wrapped around the parking lot, so I came home. I'll try again later in the week.

I'll be taking a spin around the neighborhood later today. I won't tell the local constabulary if you don't.

 

Go over the bike and make sure all the fastners are tight.

Check tha brake fluid, pads and adjustment on the rear drum.

Put bike on centerstand. Sit on the back of the seat so the front wheel lifts. See if you can move the handlebars frontward/backward to check for looseness in the steering bearings.

Check fuse box and replace if not updated.

Check alternator brushes.

Check starter brushes.

Measure/adjust valve clearances.

*****

That should keep you busy until you get the permit.

Welcome aboard.

 

Just sit on it and twist the throttle grip.

As you do ... sing:

"Whooooooo ... whaaaaa .... whaaa ... weeeeeeeeee ... eeeeeaahhhhh."

Practice your "Wave to other bikers."

Memorize your lies to traffic cops.

 

That's the plan RickCoMatic!

While MiCarl suggests the prudent course of action, my automotive apptitude is such that if I were required to do all of that stuff before getting on the bike, we'd have a permanent colony on Mars before my first ride.

I'm takin' 'er out after my son's soccer game. I'll give you a "Ride Report".

 

Most DMV's will allow you to make an appointment. Might be a good idea.

 

Not here, unfortunately, Robert. You show up, take a number, and wait, and wait, . . .

It's a moot point now, though. Didn't even have time to put the oil in after returning from my son's soccer game before a huge storm system moved in. C'est la vie.

 

Here's a thought..gasoline is a volatile liquid...if the fill plug is left off will the gas just evaporate? Ever spill some on the floor and notice how quickly it dries? If it mixes with the oil will it still eventually evaporate out?

 

When I first discovered that I had gas in the oil, a similar thought occurred to me, luna3. But then I thought about that nearly one inch hole sitting open for an extended period of time in my garage with who knows what (A mouse maybe?) finding its way into my crankcase. Any kind of covering, including screening, would only serve to restrict airflow and defeat the purpose.

RickCoMatic has essentially said the same thing, except that he says that the gas fumes will vent into the airbox and then be burned as fuel as they pass through the engine.

Thanks for the suggestion, though.

 

Man, you guys all have such beautiful bikes. That's what motorcycles are supposed to look like. Ride it like you own it, cause you do.
-Mark

 

Gas in the oil is a fairly easy thing to fix!

Drain your oil and change the filter, change the oil with a low cost oil of youre weight preference.
Ride er around for about 20-30 miles of easy riding, that will get the engine to full operating temperature.
The gas will mostly cook off and the fumes will go back into the carbs via the crankcase vent to the airfilter.

After the ride drain the oil and put your preferred oil into the machine.

NOW, comes the most important part!!!

Either fix that petcock or change it out with a manual petcock like I did.
Or get ready to be doing this again. AND it WILL happen again!

Check out this modification, http://www.xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic/t=2591.html

I would issue a caution that the adapter might not be the right size for your application. you can call Z1 and they will help you right on the phone.

Good Luck

 

hvnbnd, sounds like he has problems with the float bowls overfilling rather than a bad petcock.

Sounds like a great bike, have fun out there with it!