1. Hello Guest. You have limited privileges and you can't "SEARCH" the forums. Please "Log In" or "Sign Up" for additional functionality. Click HERE to proceed.

Brakes again!

Discussion in 'XJ Technical Chat' started by Johnius, Oct 9, 2015.

  1. Johnius

    Johnius Member

    Messages:
    122
    Likes Received:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Detroit
    Cliff notes: new braided steel lines, DOT5 fluid, speed bleeders. Install to commence soon.

    Novellette: Last year I rebuilt my calipers because I noticed uneven wear. The left caliper was completely seized and the pads were still new after 20k miles. The right side wasn't sliding on the pin, so one pad was almost to metal and the other was half worn. Bled the brakes and, knowing full well the advice of the forum and Yamaha, continued riding on 1981 lines until I could save the money to buy new ones. Finally have the money, but it slipped my mind until I heard a weird buzzing from the front end while decelerating that vanished with the application of brakes. I got home and it seemed to roll with difficulty until I pulled the right caliper. The new lines will be in today's mail.

    So, here are my questions:
    What am I overlooking?
    What should I look for while everything is apart?
    What parts will I need that I don't have?
    Does anyone else have red colored lines?
    Are red lines an esthetic mistake?
    Vacuum bleed or manual bleed?
     
  2. XJ550H

    XJ550H Well-Known Member Premium Member

    Messages:
    13,199
    Likes Received:
    3,854
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Great North Woods
    did you rebuild the master cylinder?
    oh no not the red lines...... go with red vac lines and fuel line too when you replace you plug wires they come in red too.

    did you hone the calipers? use the little brass brushes chacal sells to clean out the groves for the rings.
     
    Johnius likes this.
  3. Polock

    Polock Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    9,751
    Likes Received:
    2,093
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Beaver Falls, PA
    Is DOT5 written anywhere on the master cylinder?
     
  4. Johnius

    Johnius Member

    Messages:
    122
    Likes Received:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Detroit
    I did not hone the calipers. I cleaned them thoroughly and deburred one piston.

    I have not rebuilt the master cylinder.
     
  5. Johnius

    Johnius Member

    Messages:
    122
    Likes Received:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Detroit
    DOT3 is on the master cylinder. They actually shipped DOT4 fluid with the lines...
     
  6. k-moe

    k-moe Pie, Bacon, Bourbon. Moderator Premium Member

    Messages:
    19,613
    Likes Received:
    6,703
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    The City of Seven Hills
    DOT 3, 4, and 5 are all compatible. The difference is in the boiling point . None of them will cause the brakes to drag.

    Overfilling the master cylinder, or a plugged master cylinder return port will cause the brakes to drag. Buildup of crud in the caliper bores will cause the brakes to drag. Old piston seals will cause the brakes to drag. Worn caliper pins will cause the brakes to drag.

    have a look at the moving parts; you may have missed something.
     
    Johnius likes this.
  7. quebecois59

    quebecois59 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,285
    Likes Received:
    112
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Waterloo, Quebec, Canada
    NOw I'M confused: I just read on wikipedia that DOT5 is not compatible with DOT3 nor DOT4 because it is silicone-based rather than glycol based. THey also say the boiling point is higher (I can't see actually why an XJ rider would need that) and that is doen't damdage the paint (that is a good point for any bike).

    I know wikipedia isn't always right.
     
  8. Polock

    Polock Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    9,751
    Likes Received:
    2,093
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Beaver Falls, PA
    3,4 and 5.1 are compatible, 5 is not.
    On a clean system 5 is ok but why add confusion to the brake system
     
    quebecois59 likes this.
  9. quebecois59

    quebecois59 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,285
    Likes Received:
    112
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Waterloo, Quebec, Canada
    My-my, why didn't they call 5.1 fluid 4.3? it could have been easier to figure that 4.3 mixes with 3 and 4, and that 5 doesn't.
     
    Johnius likes this.
  10. hogfiddles

    hogfiddles XJ-Wizard, Host-Central NY Carb Clinic Moderator Premium Member

    Messages:
    14,626
    Likes Received:
    5,008
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    near utica, new york
    I just stay with 3. That way I only have to look for one number
     
  11. rocs82650

    rocs82650 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,663
    Likes Received:
    356
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Middle Tennessee
    +1.

    Gary H.
     
  12. Johnius

    Johnius Member

    Messages:
    122
    Likes Received:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Detroit
    Only the right caliper was having sticking issues. Is it safe to assume the master cylinder is functioning appropriately?

    I suppose I should test the left caliper for functionality...
     
  13. Ross1bd

    Ross1bd Member

    Messages:
    43
    Likes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Syracuse, NY
    I strongly encourage you to rebuild the master cylinder.
    Did my 750 2 years ago and one of the 900's this summer. Time (and money) well spent.

    There's a teeny-tiny hole in the floor of the MC which, when clear, allows the brake fluid to backflow from downstream, relieving pressure. If you have had uneven pad wear, while it's probably
    in the caliper, re-do the MC.
    I swore by the tiny drill bit (which Len sells) to clean that hole. On the other hand, if you play a stringed instrument, or know anybody who does, you can save a few bucks using worn-out strings.
    While the 750 SECA is a pita to work on, the MC is the easiest part of the brake rebuilding process.
    If you've spent the money for the SS lines, crush washers, caliper kits and pads, a fraction more to bring the MC up to snuff is a good investment.
    Do all of the stop system now, while you're working on parts of it.
    Unless you always ride slowly and begin braking dozens of yards before any possible stopping point.
    Now, if I could get my hands on the idiot design person who specified the cable-actuated MC...
     
  14. k-moe

    k-moe Pie, Bacon, Bourbon. Moderator Premium Member

    Messages:
    19,613
    Likes Received:
    6,703
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    The City of Seven Hills
    I like the cable actuated MC.......until I have to bleed the system (messy, messy, messy, even with a funnel).
     
  15. Johnius

    Johnius Member

    Messages:
    122
    Likes Received:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Detroit
    I use a syringe to fill the MC. It's beautiful.
     
  16. k-moe

    k-moe Pie, Bacon, Bourbon. Moderator Premium Member

    Messages:
    19,613
    Likes Received:
    6,703
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    The City of Seven Hills
    That's what my funnel is made from, but I tend to underestimate how much fluid is already in the MC.
     
  17. Johnius

    Johnius Member

    Messages:
    122
    Likes Received:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Detroit
    10mL dental irrigation syringe (has a long thin bent nose). Takes all day, though. Brake fluid is so thick.
     
  18. k-moe

    k-moe Pie, Bacon, Bourbon. Moderator Premium Member

    Messages:
    19,613
    Likes Received:
    6,703
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    The City of Seven Hills
    Brake fluid is thick?! Have you ever had to transfer bunker fuel in the winter?
     
  19. Polock

    Polock Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    9,751
    Likes Received:
    2,093
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Beaver Falls, PA
  20. Johnius

    Johnius Member

    Messages:
    122
    Likes Received:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Detroit
    So the steel lines don't fit the same way the stock lines do... If I reverse the banjos on the back of the caliper I'm not going to cause an issue am I?
     

Share This Page