1982 xj650 maxim NO SPARK...

I have no idea what is wrong, but the bike cranks over and wont start. It had been sitting for 7 years then it was ran a little and shortly quit which is when I inherited it. I cannot get this thing to start, please help.

 

welcome flathead! seems like a similar story to most of us here. there are a lot f threads on where to start, i would reccomend find those and reading them fully. you are gunna get slammed with a lot of info all at once but these bike are worth it so dont give up.

but for starters id would do an oil change, check your spark plugs for correct gap, make sure you battery is fuly charged, these bike take alot of power to start and need a good strong battery, if its an old battery get a new one! also get on ebay and get yourself a repaire manual for your bike. these should at least help get your bike feeling young againa nd hopefully get it at least cranking.

you WILL need to do more than jsut that though. your gunna need to get your valves in spec, clean out those carbs, check your back brakes for delamination and thats jsut the start, but after all taht your bike will be much better. im sure more will chime in with more info and some help full links but this will at least give you an idea of waht your looking at.

 

If it has been sitting for 7 years......a thorough carb cleaning & breaking the rack to replace throttle shaft seals & fuel O-rings is in order.....

 

to answer your starting issue... after 7 years... the battery is junk. First, however, if you get it to spin... do a compression test. then after you verify thtat the engine is sound... you have some work to do to get it on the road safely:

you NEED tires and brake hoses. front pads + rear shoes too. (the rear shoes have a tendancy to delaminate), new oil + filter, check the valve shims, carb rebuild - including throttle shaft seals + o rings. the fuse box is probably bad too... that's a weak spot on these bikes.

 

After the 7 year sit my cousin did some work on it. He re-did the entire front brake, re-did the carb and put brand new jets in it. It has brand new tires and an ignitor unit from a 1981 maxim. He had it running then had to replace both coils so they are also brand new. I don't think he replaced the fuses but they look okay.

 

I don't see an arc when I get the plug close to a ground, or even touching, but I accidentally touched it and it shocked me so I'm not sure what all that is about.

 

if the fuses are the glass tube type, you will want to update them to the modern blade style fuses, pretty simple and much safer/reliable.

 

but I still should be gettting spark should i not?

 

So I looked at the fuses again, some of the clips have broken on one side but were wrapped around the fuse to still make contact, is this enough to prevent me from getting spark?

 

Yes!

You and everyone else should replace your Fuse Panel if its an Original.

I wrote this back in 2006! Seven years ago.

http://xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic/t=2 ... +bomb.html

 

I got the new fuse box and put it in and... I still dont have any spark. I don't know if this is suposed to work, but I took an electric tester and tested for continuity from the battery/ selenoid to the spark plug. I have continuity until I turn the key on. I thought that would be normal and then I tried to see if it had continuity while cranking and it didn't. I highly doubt this was a good idea, and probably wasn't goood for the tester. Does this tell me anything useful?

 

I was told to check my grounds multiple times. Being the newbie that I am, what does this entirely consist of? Which grounds and where?

 

"Until I turn the key on" ...

Does the Neutral Light come on?

 

Yes the neutral light does come on. I am haveing trouble finding the transmission-in-neutral switch that I am supposed to be able to check.

 

If the neutral light comes on, but goes out if you pop the bike in gear, the switch is working.

If the motor spins over, then it's not a safety circuit issue (the safety circuit would prevent it from turning over at all.)

Fit BRAND NEW SET of properly gapped plugs and be sure the battery is FULLY charged. It's quite possible (and common) for an XJ to have enough battery to spin the motor but not enough current left over to fire the ignition.

And I would NOT run a full ignition "charge" (plug firing) through your tester.

 

This++

I had trouble starting even with fully charged battery, but after a reconditioning phase it fires on the first turn. Reconditioning mode is fully charging the battery first and then applying constant 1.5A current and max voltage of 15.7V for 0.5-4 hrs. This helps to bring deeply discharged batteries with stratified acid back to life.

 

Also make sure you have the right plugs. Not sure about the 650, but I think I read somewhere that they take a non-resistor type plug.

 

When you say your cousin "re-did the carb", what EXACTLY do you mean by that? Tell us SPECIFICALLY what was done..............and there are FOUR carbs--------

There's a LOT you need to do to resurrect an old bike that has been sitting that long. BUT.........if you are patient,we'll get you through it.

Dave F

 

Getting a long-time-sitter up-and-running normally requires that the Carbs get pulled and thoroughly cleaned.

You don't HAVE to split the rack.
Leave that chore to the off-season.

But, a comprehensive cleaning, ... top and bottom ... is pretty-much necessary to have the Bike run decently.

 

He stripped it all down and put in new jets. I think he may also have put new floats in. maybe. I know I do have to charge the battery it is new, but when I first tried to start it I had to put a charger on it. I haven't ever had it on a full charge so thats the next thing on my list

 

Okay , so I tried it with the battery fully charged and could tell right away that itt was cranking way faster, but I still don't have amy spark to my plugs even though I have continuity. I checked for a arc and then just to make sure, I held the spark plug when it was cranking and got nothing. Not the greatest idea but hey, it works. I am now going to try and "check my grounds" but im not sure what all it entails. If I can find out how to upload pictures to this thing I can show how I mounted my coils(It doesn't look pretty) but I am wondering if the galvanized brackets I used to mount it could be the issue. Any suggestions?

 

Since that Mod is directly connected to the Coils, ... I'd look there first.

Use the Test Light.
Connect the Light to the HOT Side of the Battery.
Touch the Probe to the Bracket.

You'll either Light the Tester ... Good Ground
Or not, ... Problem solved.

 

okay ground is good. So I tested the continuity from the battery to the plug when it was in, and the result was a continuous reading. Then, I removed the spark plug and tested continuity from battery to spark plug and the reslting reading was non-continuous. I would hate to think that the coil could be bad even though they are brand new, but could this be the case? I have continuity leading up all the way to the coils. Are these things always so nightmarish?

 

AHA!! I have a spark! ....excpect its only on cylinder 4. I changed the TCI unit back to the original one. I don't know if it was what made the difference but at least I have a healthy spark on one cylinder. I'm not sure why there isn't spark on cylinder 2 as well because they run off of the same coil. Any suggestions?

 

Two and four run off different coils.

One coil is 1-4, the other is 2-3.

The original spark plug caps have resistor cores inside that screw into them, and often become loose. Look in where the plugs go, and you'll see screwdriver slots on either side of the hole. Gently ensure the cores aren't loose.

The spark plug caps screw into/onto the wires. Unscrew each plug cap from its wire, lop about 1/4" off the wire and screw the cap back on/in. This will give the threaded spike inside the cap a fresh bite into the core of the wire.

My suggestion is that you get a service manual and properly troubleshoot this. If you're trying to run 2 and 4 off the same coil you definitely need a book.

 

yeah I meant to say 1-4 thats how they are hooked up.

 

I reattatched the coils without my improvised brackets and still no change. I get a healthy spark on one cylinder maybe on the first or second crank, but then there is nothing

 

It sadly looks like I'm going to have to take this one in to have someone else repair it. I don't have the know how to fix it now and don't have the time to learn right away because I'm leaving for college in 4 days and I can't take it with me. Hopefully I'll be able to ride it next summer after my dad takes care of it. (he'll probably ride it before I do)

 

Long time, no post, haven't been able to really work on my bike too much, but the next time I am going to try is getting a new set of coils. Is there any recommended coils? and if there are can anyone post a pic of how they set there's up? It would be much appreciated. Thank you!

 

Sounds like you're still just guessing. Did you pick up a service manual since August?

 

yes I've had a service manual and I've been through it which is why I'm guessing it may be the coils since I've pretty much exhausted every other sensible option I've seen.

 

So it's been a while. I have had someone out to look at the bike, and help me out with the electrical thing and here's what I have found out. I have power from the battery through the coils. I do not have spark when it cranks. I was told to check grounds and also entertain the possibility that the "universal" coils that were put on, were not so universal. My cousin did replace the pickup coil with a newish/used one. The main thing I would like to know is the location of the grounds on this bike, I am trying to find them and clean them up but I am having trouble as I am not sure If I located all of them. Any help would be great.

 

started cleaning grounds and connections. I got spark on two cylinders and then I let it sit for the night and came back then nothing so I'm going to clean it all over again. I'm not sure if I'm getting all the grounds, but I do have a question. are there any aftermarket coils that will fit with the gas tank? and what lube stuff is used for the spark plug wire connection to the coils?

 

For the caps to coils you can use dielectric grease. You don't need much with these caps.

Chacal carries some aftermarket coils that can be fitted. A bit of customization is needed because the brackets aren't an exact match.

 

Well it indeed has been a long project and I'm back at it on weekends again for the summer. After re-reading this thread I realize how obstinate I am when I think something is correct (and isn't). I have since learned quite a bit more and am hoping that I can finally get to resurrecting this bike. So, I have learned (for the most part) what to test and where to test it. My results are as follows: Found that pickups were way out of resistance range, reading around 125 ohms instead of the 650-700 range as specified in the repair manual. I bummed some pickups off a friends Yamazuki (a real piece of junkyard work). Pickups now read with in specified range approximately 670 ohms give or take a few. Ignition coils (new universal coils) tested approximately 10,000 ohms and 14,100 ohms on primary and secondary. (will double check that as it's a late night post). 14,000 was higher than spec but I was told it was fine. (Any one to confirm this?). Tried 4 different TCI units to no avail. One also came off of the Yamazuki (which worked when parked). So I really don't believe they all could be bad, but am not completely ruling anything out. I checked grounds multiple times. I have no spark regardless of any combination of clutch in/out with kickstand up/down (tested kickstand safety switch anyways and it was functioning properly). Ignition relay thingy makes clicking sounds when I turn the key and read that this was good.

I have no spark minus the occasional glimmer of hope. Cousin replaced killswitch after it quit so I'm going to look into that. Also, is poor timing a possibility? I'm not sure how the timing works on these things yet.

Battery will eventually be replaced when I get a little more funds, but it charges fully just fine until I run it down from cranking.

Anyways, does anyone have any thoughts at this stage of the game? Any input on timing, killswitch, or any other ideas on what it could be? I seriously appreciate all the advice so far. Thanks

Also, what is the word around town on using a battery booster to give you enough juice to crank.

 

Zombie thread . . .


If you are still speaking of the 7 + year old battery, you need to recycle it and get a new one. I wouldn't use a booster, use a verified reliable, fully charged battery.

Check all of your ground connections to the motor and your connections under the left-side cover (not sure what it is for, but I had a large wire with spade connector there that was significant corroded there). Disconnect them, visually inspect, clean if necessary add die-electric grease (re-connect!).

Consider doing this to eliminate some basic elements:
http://www.xjbikes.com/forums/threads/how-to-test-your-starter-circuit.7828/

Finally, I am sure your cousin is a good guy, but it has been said before here . . . . Nobody, absolutely nobody will take as great of care as performing service on your bike other than yourself.

 

Haha Zombie thread, I like that.

Not the original battery, however it was new when I bought so that makes it about 2 years. I will get a new one but have to make sure I have time to work on this thing and dont have it sitting around for another 3 months. Thanks for the input on the booster. Definately going to re-asses the killswitch wiring since it was also my cousin who bought pickups form the rice patty and put them on without realizing they were bad. (he didn't test them at all) but understandably, he thought he would get a functioning product.... I will go back through the link you posted and confirm what it's not.

Confirmed it's not solenoid so far.

 

Have to disagree about that last paragraph. Any bike I service be it mine or anyone's the bike is mine while in the shop and I treat it as such. The bike then goes through a test ride 15-20 min and if it's not good enough for me they don't get it back until it is because lives depend on it !
Because it's not a job it's an adventure

 

Sounds like you share blood lines with Len in the customer service vein. You should feel proud!

 

Okay, everything tested good up to #7 based on the link provided. Now is where I have hit a snag. First, I'm running a continuity test from the light blue and the neg batt. terminal. Just to clarify, open means no continuity and closed means continuous correct? If so, the circuit is open when in gear, and open sometimes when in neutral. It doesn't say to test with the ignition on, but I have done both. It seems that it is closed in neutral when I have the key on only sometimes. When I do not have the key on, also only sometimes. I am thinking I found the neutral switch on the bottom of the engine, held with two screws, with one wire running to it. I removed the two screws, but do not know how to remove the rest of it. Can anyone enlighten me on this process? Hopefully I won't have to resort to step #9 after this process is over.....

 

I think you found the oil level sensor. The neutral switch has one central screw that the light blue wire connects to, and the body of the switch has a hex head for removal. It is hidden in a deep recess next to the left frame rail, and directly bleow the shift drum (if you look right about where the toe-end of the shift lever is you're in the general location). Don't pull it without draining the oil. You may need to modify a socket to get the switch out, otherwise you'll need to unbolt the front of the engine and jack it up a bit to make clearance.

 

Thank you so much. I was wondering what the heck I was looking at/for. That makes alot more sense to me now.

 

Slow project as I am not home enough to work on it consistently. Before removing the neutral safety switch to inspect, is there an easy way to bypass it to confirm that it is indeed the problem? Like I said before, I ran through the list of checks provided and this is the last one before exorcising it with a priest. Any input would be great, thanks.

 

Take the sky-blue wire that goes to the switch and ground it to the case. That's all the switch does.

 

Neutral switch bypassed. No change. Went to the next step. I appear to be getting a closed state all the time so I'm checking that out. This is enormously frustrating.

 

I may have asked this before, but when you first turn on the ignition do you hear a click from a relay under the fuel tank?

 

90% sure yes, I'll check again when I get back home. Just picked up a 90% complete donor bike (though it is a 750 of the same year) for free so I am hoping this will help.

 

Well, final bi-annual update...... Took to a vintage bike mechanic. Had him try and figure it out. He couldn't and said he had no idea what the heck was preventing it from starting. "All the ohms check out, checked relays, etc." Tried TCI's from running bikes as well as oem and aftermarket coils. Pretty much was a mystery. Long story shirt, I'm done messing with it. For sale. Thanks for all the advice and patience, I really appreciate it.

 

Sad story, there is more help here if you would like, however if you don't have the time and just want to let it go that's not an issue either.

 

XJ650 1983 Maxim. I'm having the SAME problem....I've been enjoying the bike. Riding it up and down PCH and now in Pasadena. Went to ride it and it wouldn't start.

Had a friend come over and we sprayed some starter in near the air filter and it fired up. He said let it run for a bit. Maybe it just needed some love. Rode it all day that day.

Riding up hill the next day, 75 degrees out, perfect, under throttle, it died. Wouldn't start up again. Rolled down the hill back home. After two hours...started again.

Rode it that night. All good.

Went to start it the next day...rode it around. All good. Rode to Yamaha to ask how much for a carb tune-up, thinking maybe that was the issue...also thought maybe the ignition coils...it died. Let it sit for a minute. It started. Rode 50 feet into Yamaha...went in...came out 30 mins later. It started. Turned the corner...it died. Waited on sidewalk for 5 mins. It started...a mile down, it died. And it goes on like this...now it just won't start at all. I checked the coils and they are fine. BUT maybe it's the battery. Not even getting spark. The other night, I was monitoring the battery...it was over 17 volts. And at rest, the meter showed over 15. Not normal.

Anyway....I'm doing a lot of reading and I'm going to start with a new battery. From what I hear, the batteries can cause problems in terms of the xj650 bike. I AM not mechanically inclined...but I'm curious and I'm determined.

Reading the post above gave me some hope...very little haha but some. And I get the frustration....as you can see from my story above, it's weird. Gremlins. But there's gotta be an answer....and I'm guessing it's electrical. OH another thing....the other day I was cranking it and it wasn't firing up and I turned the ignition switch off and it sounded like a shotgun blast...LOUD out of my left side tailpipe. Other times, not so loud but like a little burst of something...I'm guessing unburned fuel...and also when I turn the key to OFF, the engine will turn a little, like a fraction of a turn....so again, I think electrical. Gotta be.