Clutch experience needed

Well my clutch is all opened up while I try to figure out whats wrong (won't go into gear) and I discovered a clutch cover seal that looks like it's been through hell :twisted: and absolutely NO OIL (except for a thin film on everything, No rust etc. :mrgreen: ) SO, here's my question. Is it possible that just new oil and a new seal will solve my problems? And what do i need to do to make sure that everthing is property coated with oil now when i put new oil in again? Thanks! Everyone here has been so helpful.

 

clutch cover gasket you mean? Unless your clutch is slipping there most likly isnt anything wrong with it. If it is moving in and out the clutch is most likely not a problem. Could be shift forks, or your gear selector, do you have a manual?

How long was it ran with no oil? Oil is always helpfull in a motor

When you put new oil in your oil pump will circulate the oil. When you install a new clutch soak the plates in oil for 10 min or so before putting them in. (if you are putting in new friction plates, as for the steel plate, check them for blueing, and warping (put them on a glass surface and see if they are flat), and general ware. This is true for any new motor parts, make sure there is a little oil on them before you install them, as long as they arnt dry.

 

All you can do is try. But make sure you adjust the clutch correctly. Also you can add a small amount of Marvel mystery oil to the oil. I use it in both my oil & gas. My motor seems to like it.

 

Before you put new oil in it, ....

Pull the Plugs.
Remove the Left Crankshaft Cover.
Put a Wrench on the Flats on the Rotor and move the Crank back and forth.
Then, rotate the Rotor in the direction of the arrow on the Rotor.

See if you can get the Bike in Gear.
If the Bike will not let you engage any gear, ... DON'T get angry and beat on the Shift Lever.

If you can't get the Bike to select a Gear; next step is to see if the SPRINGS are intact on the arrangement that rotates the Shift Drum.
If the Shifter assembly is OK; search the archives for:

Chain Guide Emergency Surgery

 

Yeah i mean gasket. Embarassing. SO... do the clutch and engine share oil? i didn't even think about that. If they do, the engine has no oil too? Thanks!

 

Have we ascertained that the clutch plates aren't simply stuck through standing? If you can engage a gear by rocking the wheel or crank, try (with plugs in for compression) making sure clutch cable is adjusted right, pulling the clutch full in and slowly pushing the bike forwards. If it tries to bump the engine over then the plates are likely stuck

EDIT-: and yes, there's a sight glass under the clutch that shows engine/gearbox/clutch oil level

 

I can put the bike into gear, but only if i rev the engine like hell and let off the clutch slowly. Then it'll go fine. Earlier this year it went through all the gears, it's been a while since I had it rideable though. do you think it's still going to be that complicated? Or since it shifts is it probably just stuck plates?

 

no prob dude!! and yes they share oil, as my buddy says this ain't a Harley son (in a backwoods tone)

 

I noticed as soon as I took the cover off you have no idea how stupid I felt. And for your question about whether it will pop into gear or not, see my last post. What do you think?

 

Alright. Thanks! SO adding oil will kill two birds with one stone, it may help fix my clutch, and vastly improve the way the engine runs too. Thanks a ton! it's always helpful to have people like you weigh in on things.

 

So it does go into gear while running? But into first with revs to not stall & an ALMIGHTY CLUNK!?

if that's the case you could be not getting full disengagement either due to a badly out of adjustment or damaged cable (outer cable stretched like a spring & compressing) Or from the lever on the clutch cover not being in it's correct position.

Not sure though, if you didn't do anything to the clutch cable/lever and it just happened after standing I'd think maybe some stuck plates

EDIT-: and if all that is definitely right, then running with oil too low to soak the clutch would make it very grabby, which now I think of it, could well be what you described...

 

Alright, so by doing new gaskets (all around i presume) may solve it? and having oil would help the engine? (which doesn't currently idle, but thats a whole new can of worms) Thanks for all your help! Its appreciated!

 

Do you mean centering? I am/was under the impression that the clutch assembly is symmetrical, so the rotation of it won't mess with anything like the timing or anything, right? Thanks!

 

throwout, not centering. Make sure that the clutch is disengaging fully.

 

The only gasket you should need is the clutch cover depending how far you're stripped down. I'd have advised if it's been run low on oil to top up & check the motor isn't knocking first, but as the clutch cover's off & plates may be stuck/damaged you may as well pull the plates out & check them for condition & thickness (should be in the manual plate thickness. Condition = steel plates not blue from overheating & not warped when laid on plate glass)

What Kwiski means by adjusting the clutch is make sure the lever on the clutch cover is in the right position on the splines (manual shows how to line up to a line on the cover) and to adjust the clutch cable so that there's 10mm max free play at the ball end of the handlebar lever.

There's no centering to be done on a wet multiplate clutch, just ensure you keep it in order when stripping the plates off & don't overtorque the spring bolts

If you do need new plates due to damage/wear, the new friction plates need to be soaked overnight in fresh engine oil before fitting or they can burn.

 

At this point I'm playing it safe 8O if one is gone the other ones are too or will soon follow. Thank you for your help! Does the oil need to be specifically for bikes or can I use the synthetic I have laying around? How picky are these bikes ('81 seca 750) about oil? Sorry if I'm having a N00B spasm
EDITED FOR PUNCTUATION

 

VERY. Use motorcycle-specific 20W50.

 

:? what other gaskets are you planning to replace?

If there's no sign of oil leaking & the compressions are good you should only need to replace the gaskets &/or o-rings for the parts you removed, gaskets don't just "go" on these bikes, they usually only leak if the part they seal is removed & replaced without changing...

And Fitz got you on the oil, don't put no synth or car oil in her! :wink:

 

I used ultra black RTV on my clutch cover last time I took it off to put new springs and friction plates in, and it worked great.

Remember the oil level in the sight glass is only accurate with the bike standing straight up/on the center stand. If on the side stand you won't see any oil in the sight glass.

Good luck!

 

I was told to NEVER use RTV on motorcycles at all, so therefor i have never done it. so i wouldnt know the results (long and short term) instead i prefer this type of stuff Yamabond 4 is what i use the most.

http://www.yamaha-motor.com/yamalube/ca ... yamabond/1

there is another brand i have used before cant remember the name but it has number 1131 or something written in yellow on it. Both are good tacky stuff!

edit - here it is http://hodaka-parts.com/item.asp?cID=0&PID=6179

 

For paper gaskets, I prefer a spray-on gasket sealer like Permatex/NAPA High-Tack spray-a-gasket on one side, and gear oil, motor oil or grease on the other.

"Glue" the gasket to the cover and lube the other side; then it will usually be re-usable if you don't overtighten the bolts (use a torque wrench.)

RTV has limited uses in our environment. Yamabond may be a tad "HD" for some applications.

 

Curious to why that might be?

It's not like its a head gasket or valve cover or something (even though the valve cover obv wouldn't work)

It's just the clutch cover and has seemed to work just fine, no leaks at all

 

Im not sure but i would assume it could depend on what RTV you use, obviously the black being the highest for temp rating it shouldn't matter. But i used to work on vehicles and iv found getting old RTV off is a pain compared to this Yamabond stuff. RTV when it is dried seems to expand more to me. so maybe some pieces could come off and float around in the oil??? idk?

Personally i use a VERY light coating of Yamabond or 1194 when i put gaskets on, but not all gaskets, some i just use the gasket and nothing else. On 2 smokers i use it to seal the case if i split it, never had a problem so idk, i just stick with what i was told by my mentor and he has been working on bikes for 40+ years now.

 

RTV generates acetic acid as it cures, never seen it hurt when used as a gasket sealer but if you glue two pieces of steel together they will be rusted when you take them apart or they fall apart from the rust.
don't bed a rifle barrel with the stuff

 

Nail on head there I think, it's that easy to use too much of the stuff even when you're being careful & it only takes a shred to block an oilway or foul a pressure relief valve, and that (theoretical, not the o/p's) freshly inspected clutch that was OK after all, turns into a full engine rebuild :cry:

Talking of the o/p, just had a thought if the clutch was grabby, could it be worth him checking the clutch basket isn't worn where the plates engage with it whilst they're out being measured etc? If the tangs on the plates have indented the basket over time that can cause grabby, notchy clutch action too IME