Friggin 'lectricity

Hey all!

1981 xj550 rebuild. It's ran before, but won't turn on now.

Current issue is when I turn the key the lights don't even turn on. Nor the neutral indicator.

1. Yes, it's in neutral.
2. I don't have my multimeter accessible, but the digital battery charger confirms it's at least 95% charged.
3. I confirmed connection of battery cable to the terminal isn't corroded and it is connected well
4. I touched the two solenoid terminals without spark or engine response
5. Just last week I turned the key and the light came on, then faded...
6. There is a click that happens when I turn the key which comes from below the ignition coils (I'll throw some question marks here for good measure "??????")
7. When I bought the bike it had no issue with controls, but I swapped out the handle bars and have had no luck since. Which seems to be a theme.
8. Fuses look good
8. I found a link to a wiring diagram for the xj550 RH, RJ & RK. According to said diagram, the ignition goes to either the fuses, lights or connects with the regulator/rectifier, which is connected. I'm having trouble understanding then how the status of the ignition position communicates with the start button to enable "go".

I have read handfuls of threads, but I haven't found the one that addresses this specific problem. If anyone knows how to find said thread, can you please link me to it? Otherwise do ya'll have some suggestions?

Skill level: quasi intermediate?

Cheers!

B

 

Did you use painted handlebars if so you have to add a ground from the control to the frame or to the main harness. Follow the right control back to the main harness you will see a black wire coming from the control and nothing to make to in the main harness that black wire is a ground wire you can either cut it and an extension and bolt it to the ignition coil we can buy the meeting connector from XJ forever and make it look like a professional job

 

What's the xj550 you should hear a click under the tank and I click under the seat there is a relay under the seat pull it out see if your troubles go away if they do it is your side stand switch

 

550 seca or Maxim? makes a difference in the wiring harness
The battery connects to the main fuse. Then the main fuse connects to the ignition switch. When you turn the key to on it sends power down a brown wire to the other three fuses which supplies electricity to your ignition your headlight and your signals. It could be you have trouble with your ignition switch and it needs to be cleaned.
At minimum you need to buy a $5 test light which looks like a screwdriver with a light bulb in it alligator clip on one end and you just touch the other end to what you're testing. You really do need to buy a meter even a $10 meter will work for you.

Also just because your battery charger says your battery is at 95%, it doesn't mean the batteries any good. Put your charger to the battery then jump across the two bolts on the solenoid and see what the meter on the battery charger says if it drops to zero charge you have a bad battery. The best way to test this is with a meter on the battery and when you press the starter button you see what your voltage drops to. The battery should be sitting at 12.8 volts and when you press the starter button it should not drop the low 10 volts.

 

No spark when you touch the two nuts on the solenoid together with a screwdriver or a quarter indicates your battery isn't doing anything. Check the ground wire from the battery to the motor make sure the ground wire is clean at the battery it is also a second ground wire that comes from the motor with the battery ground wire connects to that connects under the battery box to the frame. Both these wives are important to be clean and connected properly . Is not grounded to the frame by the bolts that hold it in place so you will get a reading the motor is grounded by the battery wire and the frame is grounded by the wire that runs from the frame to the motor where the battery wire connects if you can touch a light bulb across the solenoid bolts try that see if it lights up it should glow brightly

 

Is your battery connected the right way make sure the pluses to the Plus and the minuses to the ground.
With a meter or a test light you can chase the voltage. oh hey I'm going to throw this out there is your kill run switch in the right position? This happens a lot.

With a meter or a test light you can check to see if you have voltage on both sides of the fuses by touching the crimps and a ground. The bulb should glow brightly.

 

multi-meter is one of the mandatory tools that you must have and know how to use:

http://nadp.sws.uiuc.edu/cal/PDF/MulltimeterUse.pdf

https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/how-to-use-a-multimeter?_ga=1.238289411.262114863.1436923213

http://www.masonmonitoring.com/pdf/support/UsingMultimeter.pdf

http://www.autoshop101.com/forms/elec12.pdf

 

1981-3 XJ550 Maxim WIRING DIAGRAM
http://members.tripod.com/dave_jack/wiringdiag/d1a.jpg
and
http://members.tripod.com/dave_jack/wiringdiag/d1b.jpg

How to Read a Schematic - learn.sparkfun.com

 

Is chrome considered "painted"? I don't remember if it's actually chrome plated, but it's not powder coated or painted in the traditional sense.

 

Thus far no click behind the battery or under the seat. I think I'm just going to order a set of relay's for the whole bike. If I'm correct, (aside from the light relays) there are only 3 ( start cut off, solenoid, and side stand).

 

It's a Maxim. Agreed! Essential utility. I have one, but it's in my truck and my father-in-law has the truck. I'll get it back tomorrow. I agree on the battery. I called a local shop about an hour ago and he said to bring it in and he'll check the CCA's which I will do tomorrow as well. I do have the test light, but I'm not sure what to test.

 

Battery is connected properly. I thought this originally was a kill switch problem so I bypassed the kill switch via connecting the two wires that are on the setting of "run". No luck. I did also swap out the fuses and tested with new ones for the "main" and the "ignition". No luck.

 

I will check these ground wires!

 

This is awesome! Thank you!

 

I think this is the same one I was referring. I checked out these sites and more for wiring. Thank you for the references!

http://lumien.se/stuff/xj550/XJ550ElectricalDiagram1.1.40.png
https://members.tripod.com/dave_jack/id39.htm

 

Update: I checked the battery again tonight and it was at "0%". I will take it in for CCA testing tomorrow. I did see that the rear light turned on. No juice to the front of the bike and I don't even hear the clicking. I think the battery might be j.u.n.k. I'll post again what I learn about the battery. Thank you for the feedback!

 

You have a wiring diagram and a lamp and wire?
Then stop guessing and start testing.
You said you linked across the solenoid, no sparks or starter turning engine over?
Your battery is dead or not connected properly. Use lamp and wire to test.
Test think test, read diagram, think, repeat. The answer is in your hands.
I may be sounding harsh, but asking forum members to guess is worse than guessing yourself, you need to apply logic, and soon you will be an expert.

 

I'd agree that it's more harsh than needed, but whatever, moving on.

As I mentioned in a previous comment, I wasn't sure what to test. I'll have the battery tested today and get some answers moving forward. This is probably a stupid question, but if the battery has no juice, then none of the fuses are going to give me any light, right? I put the test light on a few things without any result so I assumed I was doing it wrong. I have the clamp on one of the rear brackets of the frame which is painted black as the rest of the frame. Is that sufficient for a ground? Or will it not work BECAUSE it's painted as was mentioned previously about the handlebars?

 

Update: Wilst the battery held a charge I was able to verify the following with and without the test light:

1. The solenoid created spark and the engine responded with a weak turn over sound
2. The fuse turned the test light bright, but I tested it again at a later point and it gave no light. Repeated again with same results respectively. Hm. Also, sometimes when pressing the test light onto the fuses, I'd hear clicking from under the tank
3. I will attach photos of the relays I tested, I think I identified them correctly via this sight
http://lumien.se/stuff/xj550/XJ550ElectricalDiagram1.1.40.png
4. There was more clicking, occasionally, but not consistently from behind the battery housing
5. There was no response when I hit the start button with the exception of a few clicks from behind the battery

 

You'r testing - that's progress. If you need to check battery ground do a test across the battery direct, then do the same thing from frame to battery +ve.
When testing with a light (or a meter of any sort), allways use the wiring diagram, following the circuit you want to test along. Apply logic, look carefully at the drawing of switches etc - sometimes they are difficult to follow, but they usually make sense if you persevere (and ask if something doesn't make sense). Nobody, unless they have the wiring diagram in they're head, can test a circuit to fault find without the diagram.
I think you need a new battery by the sounds of it.
Once fitted and charged, jam an old screwdriver across the solenoid to see if the starter works, then go through ignition switch, fuse, safety relay, cutoff switch on the bars, start push button.
See if you can follow that path on the diagram - I appreciate it's a bit like a maze at first, but like everything, it will make sense eventually.
Sorry for being harsh...
Huw

 

Chrome plating is electrically conductive.

 

Thanks for this!

 

Update: Battery tested poorly, bought a new one and charged it. It turned on the rear light and neutral light, however, the test light again failed on the fuses.

Moving forward I'm going to order a new fuse box/kit from xj4ever to see if this eliminates some of the hiccups. I have new start button instrument and have started some of the rewiring to replace the old. I'm also going to start on the carbs so when the electrical is ready to go I can get the newly resealed tank on and see how it runs. More updates in the future. Thanks for everyone's thought's this far!

B

 

Hi Barb, moving forward - good call on the troblesome fuses. I would suggest you finish and test the electricals before stripping the fuel system - make sure it cranks over on the button, you have sparks and lights.
The reason for this should be obvious, you don't want to be tracing multiple issues until you're a pro fault finder.

 

Yaaaaaa. Ya, you're right. Thanks for this.

 

I'll add that even as a former pro, tracing multiple faults requires patience and a good notepad. It's so easy to get confused when you are tired and/or frustrated. I've made plenty of VERY expensive mistakes by trying to hurry up.
Slow is smooth. Smooth is fast.

 

Update: I have replaced the fuse box with the complete kit from XJ4Ever. The light test is consistent with the new box, so that's a great starting point. I realized after more research that I had not actually verified the relays themselves, versus just confirmed there was juice TO the relay. So I grabbed some alligator clips, a D battery, got my multimeter back (and watched the videos above on proper usage), and tested for resistance and continuity. Thus far the starter shut-off relay, headlight, and side stand relays are confirmed. A connector in the headlight assembly tested for resistance when I pulled in the clutch in, so I believe that is working as well. I have installed an aftermarket kill/start switch. Since the new controls don't have the exact same setup as the XJ, in that the connections in the "on" position of the kill switch need to be satisfied on the XJ, I connected the two wires so the relay is satisfied when moved into the "on" position. (I hope I'm not losing people here).

What I know:
When I connect the wires to the new start/kill switch controls, I get a click from the relay, but nothing else.
When I measure values from just the new controls with the multimeter via pressing the start button, I don't get any values.
Nothing happens when I actually push the start switch when fully connected to the wiring harness.
The headlight gets juice, but no light. I will get a bulb here shortly.
I tested the solenoid again via touching the two points and the engine responds and I get spark.
I think I mentioned before I have a new battery.

What I don't know:
Bikes after 1977 (?) were/are required to have headlight turn on when the ignition is in the "on" position. Would an out light stop the starting process? Does the light also need to be satisfied to start the bike? My assumption is no as your bulb could go out at any time and this feature could leave you stranded anytime/place.

My next step is getting a bulb and making sure it's the bulb and not the wiring in regards to the headlamp. I will keep working with the wiring at the controls and also from the kickstand. Any other thoughts? I may also try connecting the OG controls for kicks.

Best,

B

 

I may be wrong, but I think there is some sort of relay or diode contraption that only lights up the headlight once the engine is running. The idea being to reserve power for the starter until the engine is running. Maybe keep that in mind before spending too much time on the headlight - it may be a red herring.

 

headlight comes on after motor spins fast enough, or when it starts on a 550. bike will start without a headlight bulb.

550 has a starter safety relay and under the seat a sidestand relay both will click when key is on and bike in neutral with sidestand down.


if you remove the sidestand relay under the seat it bypasses the sidestand switch this is only to test the sidestand switch

sidestand switch will prevent bike from starting when in gear and sidestand down.

 

starter button on oem control grounds through the handle bars . there is no ground in the main wiring harness connector. for the oem control in the connector there is a ground wire to nowhere.

what happens is when proper relays close voltage is sent to the starter solinoid (also called a starter relay) with a red wire then the blue wire runs to starter button and when button is pressed it makes ground which activates solenoid, .

check how the starter button works in your new control
do a continuity test to ground of the starter button by hooking meter to ground and the blue wire coming from the solinoid connector. press button see what you get.

with test lamp hook to plus on battery and the same blue wire . when you press button light should light

 

Making good progress there @Barb , starting to think logically. You’ll be an expert in no time.

 

I understood *most* of this, but some of it wasn't clicking for me. I got that it had to do with a loss in ground:I reviewed the wiring diagram again, googled all kinds of stuff about grounding/earthing, searched "grounding xj550" and another thread you commented on came up. I think you said the same thing differently, but whatever it was it finally clicked in my head. So I snipped the wiring harness end of the ground wire, cleaned up a connection to the frame and mounted it, connected the L/W and ground wire. Guess what. IT WORKED!!!!!!!!!

HEEEEEEEYYYYYYYY YYYOOOOOOUUUUU GUUUUUUUYYYYYYYSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!




(My emotions included zero violence, but I'd argue the same intensity)