Middle drain plug has lots of oil stains around it?

Hey there, planning on giving the bike her first oil change. I did the valve shims yesterday and the oil reeked of gas. I blame the leaky petcock for that. I installed an on/off petcock to hopefully eliminate that problem. My oil is black as night and smells like gas.

I'm still waiting for advance auto to get my filter in , I took a look at the middle drain plug and theres dried up oil stains all around that bolt.... Just asking here what should I expect when I pull that bolt? There are no leaks right now, but will one form once I take off that bolt/drain/put bolt back on? Anyone ever seen this before?

Thanks!

 

It is the opinion of many on this forum (most know more than I), that you should leave that drain plug alone. The amount of oil you're likely to drain is minimal (like a couple of tablespoons) and your chances of stripping something out is quite high....that was the long answer...short answer ....leave that plug alone

 

Are you talking about the middle gear drain plug or just the drain plug on the sump?

The reason I ask is that it's kind of hard to see the middle gear drain plug. (The one you should leave alone.)

The only drain plug you remove to change the oil is this one:

 

Also note that fuel in the crankcase, which is a result of the carbs overflowing, is caused by a leaky petcock AND leaky float valves in one or more of the carb bowls. Even if you correct the petcock issue with an on/off valve, you can still overflow the bowls while running the bike if the float valves don't properly meter fuel in the bowls.

Wet set your fuel levels and remedy as necessary. Overflowing fuel bowls will cause a horribly rich running condition, and still might result in gas in the crankcase.

 

Sufficiently thinned oil can weep past an otherwise leak-free drain plug. That might be the cause of the staining.

 

Wait a minute... Fitz.. I'm literally about to do an oil change. The "book" said to do middle drain plug and the one you pointed to in this thread, AND the filter. (I plan on changing the filter today too)...

So If I'm not doing the middle drain plug (I have to get on my back to see it) how much oil should I put in? Some quick help would be great as I want to do this as soon as I can so I can get a ride in today!

 

the amount of oil need is stamped on your engine, i believe near the clutch cable or oil sight glass, some where in the general area. for example mine says 2200 CM3 which translates to 2.2 litlers of oil. i would only pull the drain plug that is referenced in the pic that fitz posted, and the one above it for the filter of corse.

 

Well I skipped the middle drain plug and went by the XJ 650G book. It said 2.8L when doing a filter swap so that's what I put in. The oil went "just" under the sight glass when putting in ~2.8 qts. I think I'm good to go. Lets hope no gasoline enters the oil this time around! Who knows when that oil was changed anyways. Glad there is fresh oil in there! A little more to it than doing a car but still pretty simple. Had to get a dental pick to remove the o-ring from the filter bolt. And it took some coercing to get that bolt out of and into the housing.... is that normal?

 

It shouldn't be a fight!

Lube the Filter Dome Bolt's O-ring.
Dress the first 22mm of the Bolts Threads with Anti-Seize Compound.

Use a 6-Point Socket and tighten the Bolt to 11-Foot-pounds.

 

I find it a bit of a juggle to install the filter cover against the spring pressure, while lining up the cover with the engine case. Not really "hard" and turning the bolt should be easy, but actually getting it lined up, upside down, can be a little "uncomfortable." If you force the bolt through the cover, before trying to install it, even when the o-ring is lubricated, it does take a bit of force.

If I were you, I really wouldn't neglect the float bowl fuel level. Your carbs are just going to over flow while you are riding if the float valve isn't working properly.

 

I think the float valve works on the carbs. I need to give them a cleaning, just very terrified of it, and I don't have the tools to sync them when I'm done. I'll get to it!

I think the reason my oil was full of gas was because the petcock was a constant leak. Putting in the on position still let gas dribble the whole time. I replaced it with an on/off petcock, so we'll see if that solves the problem. Reason I say the floats work is because I never saw any gas outside the carbs. I would think that feeding the gasoline constantly, even when off they would leak if the float bowls didnt work....

Someone's definitely been in the carbs before, there's 2 new carb hats on there and 2 of the bowls were put on backwards (mixture screw facing inside of bike, not accessible).... I'll get to those one of these days!

It's time to ride to work!

 

The float bowl has fuel valves that regulate the fuel flow based on the level of fuel in the bowl. If those don't leak, then you don't get gas in your crankcase.

I'm not suggesting that the float bowl GASKET is leaking, but that the VALVE in the fuel bowl is leaking. Gas will drain into the intake, you won't see it anywhere except the oil or the air box. You will continue to have problems with fuel delivery, a rebuild can't wait.

The bowls may have indeed been put on backwards, but those aren't mixture screws, those are drain screws.

Don't be afraid to rebuild the carbs. It's not hard, and there are people here to help you out. But you should probably park it until you solve all of these issues.

 

This is NOT the CAUSE. A leaky petcock only "enables" the issue further.

YOU HAVE A STUCK, STICKY OR MISADJUSTED FLOAT (or floats.) If your floats were all working properly, you could leave the petcock on PRI and nothing bad would happen.

UNTIL YOU FIX YOUR CARBS, you will continue to pollute your oil.

Continue riding the bike with gas-diluted oil and you'll kill the motor.

 

OK cool, I guess I'll be pulling the carbs in a couple weeks. Can't do it next weekend, I have my MSF safety class.

How do i pop the floats out of those posts without breaking the posts? I heard that they break easily....

 

Manbot,

Thanks for the advice man, I'm gonna clean out the carbs in a couple weeks.
Lets hope all goes well!

 

Problem is all the intake boots are cracked to hell, I'm afraid to remove them because as of right now they're not leaking... Do I need to buy all new ones or is there a temporary fix like high temp silicon or something? I want to clean these carbs but I'll need 160 in intake boots if I plan on changing those.

 

Fear not carbs. Besides all the info here, Max has some good videos you can watch to be familiar with what you'll see.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exa467_e ... 2BD945AE00

As for the cracks on your rubber, RTV and a covering work well if you need it. but often surface cracks are just surface cracks.

http://www.xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic/t=37200.html

 

As for the intake boots, often the cracks don't go all the way through. The only way to tell for sure is to flex them from the inside once the carbs are off. If the cracks do not go through, you can flex them, flush 'em clean and pack them with high-temp black adhesive RTV.

QUIT running the motor until this is fixed. It will just keep dumping gas into the oil, and you stand a good chance of damaging the motor.

 

Max, thanks for the links!

Fitz, I guess I'm done riding till this is fixed. Dammit man. Better than a ruined engine though. Pack them with high temp rtv, the outside you mean right?

Ugh, I gotta figure out how to do this in an outdoor single parking spot! This will be interesting... Can I leave the opened up carbs on my balcony overnight so I can work on this after work a little everyday? As long as it doesn't rain I dont think a few mosquitos on the carbs will hurt anything