Power comparison: XJ650 vs Ninja 500 Anybody know?

I'm thinking about getting a Ninja 500. I like the older design of the body as opposed to the newer "tank in your craw" crotchrockets.

The 250, I think, is too little displacement for freeways around Houston even though the mpg is tempting.

I currently have an xj650 w/pods and 4-1 exhaust.

Does anybody have any idea how the bikes would compare in acceleration and top-end cruising capabilities?

 

Hopefully woot will chime in, he's our resident Ninja expert. From my experience, I'd say the two bikes would be fairly comparable, but the XJ tops out at about 115-120 (due to gearing), where the Ninja would probably do a bit higher. Also, I'd say the XJ would have the Ninja whooped in the torque department too, which is what makes the bike FEEL really fast riding around town.

Also, the Ninja would surely out-handle the XJ on a race track, but I think it all depends on how you use the bike. For what it is, I think the XJ is a great all-around bike. Sporty enough to not be stuck with the cruisers, but comfortable enough that you don't have to stop and take a break every 30 minutes like the sport bike guys.

 

I suspect that Woot will jump in here and give you some good info. I also suspect that he will disagree with you about the power from the 250. They seem to be very well thought of and I have been tempted by them myself. I understand that they have no problem cruising at 80+ mph. Their light weight makes a tremendous difference in performance. The 500 has 60 HP but weighs more than 100lbs less than an XJ. Having not ridden one, I can't speak too intelligently about them but I think I have some pretty good guesses. I suspect it would be far faster off the line than an XJ though top speed is probably similar. They are said to be very comfortable, but that is in the eye of the beholder. I've done several 300+ mile days on my RJ and find it very comfortable over the long haul. While the EX does not have the extreme position of some sport bikes, it's still a sport bike and you either like that or you don't. The liquid cooled, DOHC, four valve per cylinder EX motor looks very nice. I would expect it to be as bulletproff as an XJ engine and that seems to be general concensus. Given the smaller displacement, the EX probably has to rev significantly higher at highway speeds and therefore may be a bit buzzy comparted to an XJ, but I've read no complaints about this.

I bet the EX parts are easier to come by too. May or may not matter to you. It would me.

Best,

Greg

 

Hey guys - found it - I'm still about reading far more and replying far less... I'll try to work on the later Busy busy.

The 250 is great little bike. I've got a few graphs I've done for it showing hp and speeds.

The 500 is a smaller step up than it sounds. My experience with the 500 is alot less. I have had a bunch more experience with the next step up the 88-97 zx600r c model.

So the 500 - shares the same technology as the 250 essentially. It has good gas milage, it has a nice sized tank, it handles like a sporty standard, and not like a sport bike. It will out handle the maxim, however, don't think about comparing it to a recent 600. You could compare it to the C model 600 that I had - in which case you'd say simular comfortable ergos, similar handling characteristics. Brakes on the 600 were good, the 500 I suspect are as good as I think they might share some components.

As mentioned the 500 ninja has alot of used parts available. They've been making essentially the same bike for nearly 20 years. This years is only different in plastics, maybe a tiny bit different ignition module, and the rest is just about plug and play.

The 250 - except for the first year, some minor ignition changes in 94 and some changes to rev limiter after that has been the same bike since 86/87.

The 250 is a surprisingly capable bike. Dyno results put it at ~28 r.w.hp. I'd suspect the 500 to be ~50hp, and the maxim maybe 55-60hp. I saw a 750 seca dyno at ~62hp.

Remember the 500/250 are both 6 speeds, so you'll get a bit better gear ranges than the 650's 5 speed. Buzziness could be a factor, but I've never experienced bad vibrations on the 250.

I guess I should toss out other bikes to consider. The yzf600r is probably too sporty in your opinion. Personally I don't find it much sportier than the 250 or 600r. It's a nice bike. I also like the looks of the GS500e and GS500f. The sv650 is probably too sporty, but what about the DL650? It's really capable off road, and nice on the highway apparently.

I'm also a big fan of the older 600s like the C model. Never rode the D model, but the C model felt and looked like the 250 with the added punch people always think they need Great milage and great comfort. I've also ridden a gpx400 which is the same bike minus 200cc. The thing with those two bikes is they haven't been made in years, so used parts are harder to find. Which is why the ex500 is so nice.

In all honesty, I think the ex250/ex500 you mentioned are probably some of the best bikes built, with plenty of spares. I don't think the 250 is as far behind the 500 as many people claim. The 250 stock will get to just a bit over 100mph real world speed, close to 110mph if you could get it to redline (drafting/downhill/tucking). It won't have the punch the 500 would, but it's still going to out perform most cars in the 0-60 range. Don't pull out with no room at speeds over 60mph... it certainly won't accelerate from 80mph to 100mph in the same way my 600 will. Then again, that's completely illegal.

Here's the part no one tells you - flogging the 250 is many times more fun than idling on the 600... I suspect you'd get be a bit of both worlds with the 500.

What are you planning on using the bike for? For an idea of what people do with the 250 check out http://www.ninja250.org/ - and look for Leon's bike. He's ~6'3" and rides with a cooler on back!!!

 

here is a little clip of the ex250 playing...

http://www.ninja250.org/videos/garyj.wmv

remember it is SUPPOSED to be revved... it's such a hoot to ride hard.

I guess I killed this thread

 

I'm going to mostly be commuting on it. I do quite a bit of interstate riding in Houston, where traffic is pretty thick, mostly traveling 75mph+.

I feel ok on the xj I have, but I'm not really comfortable revving a 25 year old engine up to 7k. Call me overly cautious. And I don't really want to go into the engine.... Call me lazy. I was thinking about selling and buying something newer that gets a little better mileage. Since I did my rejetting/pods/exhaust, I'm only getting low to mid 40's in mpg... That's not much better than a toyota or honda car. Part of my justification for risking my neck during the commute is mpg, so this argument won't stand up when SWMBO finds out what kinda mileage I'm getting. The tiny tank on the xj also lends to trouble, since I can barely make it 100 miles before I have to gas up.

I've got minor oil leaking around valve cover gasket, and somewhere a little lower, but I can't locate the exact source. So that's another thing I don't want to have to go into... And it's still running great.

So I guess the question is: does the 500ex have the umph to get me out of a jam at 70+ mph with a grab of the throttle at least as much as the XJ650? I'd rather have a little more, but I really don't want the super sporty style of the 600's out there.

I've also been thinking about a Vulcan 750.. Any opinions there?

 

I'd stick with the EX-500 myself (no, I'm not getting one but if I had to I wouldn't mind). As Woot points out they are capable handlers and parts are plentiful.

 

At 75mph the 250 won't accelerate as fast as a motorcycle, but it will accelerate the same as a car. The 500 I would suspect would accelerate as quickly as the maxim up there - particularily with the gearing advantage.

The other thing both the 250/500 have is low weight, and very nimble. Something I don't expect you to find from the vulcan. Then again the vulcan should be nice and low and also great for stop/go traffic.

I don't think the 750 vulcan will actually outperform the maxim by much if any. I have a friend with a savage and it was a savage disappointment. Absolutely left him behind everywhere we went - by accident as I wasn't even revving to do it. The savage had low hp numbers and a narrower hp band. I'd check into the vulcan before committing - you will be giving up the free revving maxim for a lower revving bike with some more torque... depends on what you like...

For commuting around here - the 250 would be perfect... but then again I'd top out around 70-75 and at that speed wouldn't be looking to really pass people (cops are busy here - over 75 and it's a certain ticket.)

 

I used to laugh at my buddy's Savage (called him "Thumper" because of it). Kawi screwed that one up, no power and lackluster handling. A bore really. I'm still voting for the 500, enough power to get yourself in trouble if you hit the interstate. About town the 250 would be wisdom (although I LOVED my GPZ750A1).

 

Ya - either way - 500 is probably going to be most like the 650's power with a bunch of benefits. The con? It's not a maxim

 

not that it matters but the savage is a suzuki not a kawasaki

 

Sorry, never paid that much attention. I was laughing too hard.

 

FWIW, twin vs four....

Back in the mid 90's I had an 83 GS550E, a 16valve 4 cylinder bike that I once coaxed 210km/h out of. I figured my buddy's new GS500 wouldn't be any match for it. We were riding one day and we both nailed the throttle, with me fully expected to leave him in the dust. He kept up with me no problem. Ok, I figure the fact that I have about 50lbs on him let him keep up with me, so we swap bike and the same thing happens. Considering that the EX is probably a fair bit faster than a GS500, and considering the fact that a GS550E is probably faster than a Maxim, I'd say the EX would be as good, or better than the Maxim at highway speeds, while getting better mileage and enjoying MUCH better parts availability, plus having liquid cooling thrown in as a benefit. Just a thought.

Either bike will leave a 750 Vulcan for dead.

 

Thanks. That's very helpful. Now all I need to do is figure out how cheap I can make the insurance, and how I can expand my paycheck to let a new bike drive through it. 8O

Really, I appreciate the input, guys.

 

Hey MacMcMacmac - I'm in Toronto for the week! No bike and no time unfortunately... Just a wave from the same province.
Woot.

 

Enjoy the Big Smoke. Haven't gone there yet. No compelling reason to so far. If I go back to Alberta next spring, I may miss the experience altogether!

 

another "new" bike that you may want to consider is the new kawasaki ninja 650 r. Its a parrallel twin just like on the EX500. Its got sweet styling and more displacement. The price is in the 6G range.Now theres something to consider! Or you could consider any used bike made in the 90s as long as its been treated well, and come out with even more bang for your precious buck and have very close to modern day performance. Good luck and let us know how it all turned out.

 

I rode the 650... it's a neat little bike. Very smooth and modest power - comparable to the xj650.

It needs to have some thought put into bags as the tail is slender and the tank is funny shaped...

Bars were nice and high (a plus for many people) and the air deflected nicely off the screen.

Suspension was awesome for that price range... certainly better than the maxim and as good as the 90's sport bikes.

Well worth a test ride.

 

I can't give you a comparison because I have not ridden my xj650 but I did buy a brand new leftover 05 ninja last march. I am happy with it overall. The things that I like about it are that it's fairly quick, but not so much that its going to surprise you, it is a comfortable riding position, it handles pretty good but the stock tires kind of scare me from hanging off it to much, I don't ride it very hard so I get about 60mpg. The only negative that I can think of are lack of storage under the seat, hands get a little numb from vibration after about an hour, the wind screen actually causes more wind noise, sometimes I wish it had a little more power. My next bike will probally be a Honda VFR or a Ducati Monster. As for insurance, I financed mine through Kawasaki, kawasaki credit card, and they don't require full coverage insurance. Check their promotions, I got 6.99% for 24 months but it has to be paid off or it reverts to 17%. My liabilty insurance is $85 a year with Dairyland. And if your curious I paid $4500 out the door, not bad for an msrp of $4995. Not a great deal but fair.

Scott

 

Wind noise can be reduced in 4 ways:

- shorten the windscreen
- lengthen the windscreen
- get a different helmet
- wear earplugs

The later comment should be really considered... alot of the riders who've ridden a bit longer are complaining about hearing damage... I know that over the past 7 years my ears are not as good as they were. Not all of that was from motorcycles but I wear plugs every ride now.

The mpg of the 250/500 ninja's is really impressive... I know some of the 250 guys are actually hitting 70mpg.

 

I know I should wear ear plugs and I have no excuse because I have to wear them at work and I can get them for free.