xj550 maxim, starting problembs help please

i got a 550 maxim, ive been trying to get her started for days now,
charged battery up, cleaned,near new plugs up, new fuel,
wont start on the switch,it just cranks over,
if i bump it,she fires up, straight away,idles on 1.5,ish, as soon as i put lights on,it dies,
try starting on switch, it just turns over,if i press it now and then, she pops, but if i do it,for a while, it just cranks over, bump starts first time, help please

 

How old is that battery?

 

Battery or connections.

"Charged up" doesn't mean "strong and healthy." Take your battery to the local auto parts or garage and have it load tested.

The bike's entire electrical system runs off the battery below about 2000rpm.

 

ok ta,i have a brand new suzuki gsx 600f i havnt used, so ill try that first,see wat happens, so thats y i prob cant get it to fire up? i even tried it with a car battery,and did the same?

 

umm if the car batt cant jump her you deff have an electrical issue. check your grounds. and what you mean by "bump it"? it you turn on your lights and it dies you may have a short or some crossed wires. possably kill switch is wired to your headlight switch lol?

just curious does it accually run? if it wont start at all and your getting backfires and pops you may have your coils switched around, right hand coil goes to cylinders 2 & 3, left hand goes to 1 & 4 i do believe. electrical issues can drive me crazy sometimes.

 

Remove the Battery.
Give it a Full Charge.
Bring it to AutoZone.
AutoZone will do a FREE "Cranking-amps Test" for you.

But, every XJ-Bike made is a real bear to get started when it cold out.
Since you CAN Bump-start it.
Get that Battery tested.
Check your Alternator Brushes. (10mm or less = replace)

You should see +14.2V ~ +14.5V charging current at the Battery when the Plant is making 2,000 rpm's and above.

 

in english terms,bump,means put in second gear, ignition on, run with the bike then jump on,and let go of clutch,

it runs fine, i do need some diaphrams,but i repaired them, for the mean time,
it does charge the battery, and lights dim, until u rev it,then they go brighter,so could be battery, the earth terminals,and the coils are fine.

 

Charge the Battery.
Have it Tested for Cranking Amps.

 

brand new battery,and plugs, good spark, its charging the battery when its running., still wont fire up,on switch,if u give it very small press on the button,she tries to start, but if u try it for a while nowt. but bump no probs,i got a spare loom with the bike,im going to put that on,at the weekend,as they put a twin light set up, loads of wires all over the place, so ill get a single light,and go from there,

need to find a carb set up, wat will work,as to buy the diaphrams,are very expensive,and cant find any second hand carbs,

 

If you can't find any second hand carbs for a 550 then you haven't been looking very hard.

They're all over eBay.

It sounds like your problem could be the starter itself if not the solenoid or wiring.

 

IM IN ENGLAND, and i found a set,and asked wat was the diaphrams are like, and he said,he didnt know,and is not willing to take them apart,.


id buy lots if people would ship it over, as my wife has the c reg 700 maxim,and needs silencers, i need carbs,and a horn,for my 550.

 

OK THEN, please put your location in your signature so we don't keep sending you to AutoZone.

 

One of the most common problems for a Starter not performing is the accumulation of Carbon Dust within the Commutator Housing.

Removing the Starter ... exposing the Commutator and Spraying the Commutator, Brushes and Housing ---> CLEAN of accumulated Dust will eliminate the problem ... IF ...the Brushes aren't worn below specs.

Spray with:
Rubbing Alcohol
Electrical Parts Cleaner
Contact ReNu

 

hope that works, so if i take starter brushes out, it should give me, more spark,on constant?

 

You dont take the Brushes out.

 

If it wont start when you try it with the Starter, ... but will "Bump", ... the Starter is using the load off from the top of the Battery and there isnt enough reserve to power anything else.

 

This is all going to end in tears :lol:

 

ok so explain, y it wont jump of a car battery, but the battery starts my car,afterwards,hehe

 

Are you still running an Original Fuse Panel?
That's a known No Start issue.

 

yep still origional loom,and glass fusses,all nice and clean, checked for contact,with wires,all good, new solenoid, as i said, shes crnking over great, but not kicking, in england the diaphrams for the carbs,are 60 pounds each, id rather buy a whole set of carbs for that, with posting,ect.but,im good with most bikes,and this ones stumped me, as i cant see,y the brushes on a starter will make her fire up? as its cranking over great, and lots of compresion,

 

OK. Please understand that we don't just make stuff up, and I've learned this one the hard way. I have TWO fully operational 550s, BTW, check my sig.

Yes, it's cranking over great. But if the starter is drawing too much current, it can take so much that there is nothing left to fire the ignition.

This generally occurs with a marginal or weak battery. The first time it happened to me, I couldn't believe it. Bike would SPIN as fast as could be, no fire until the split second I let go of the button. In my case, it was a battery on the edge of death.

However, if your battery has TESTED FINE (I don't care if it's allegedly "new" TEST IT any good garage should be able to) and the bike spins as fast as it should with the starter but won't fire; then fires just fine on a bumpstart-- all symptoms point to a starter drawing too much current. Cleaning said starter and replacing the brushes could very well be the cure; it just doesn't seem to follow at first.

Back to that original fusebox: the original fuse clips are made of some mysterious crapmetal dipped in an alloy of who knows what and will actually crystallize over time and break all on their own without being touched. Had it not happened to me, I wouldn't have believed it either. This was long before I discovered this forum, and it spoiled a Sunday morning ride.

You can replace the fusebox with a modern, blade-type; or rebuild the original. Do you have Radio Shack stores in the UK? If so, I'll give you the part number.

 

We alerted the membership about Fuse Panel failure some time ago.

Here's the line to my original post:

http://xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic/t=2 ... =bomb.html

 

Well your issue is multifaceted for sure. Likely your battery is not 100% healthy-sad to say but most modern batteries are like everything else-they are designed to die before they should. Second your mixtures aren't right-and/or your plugs are lame. Too much? Well they are all indicated by your issue.

#1-have your battery load tested, or replace it.
#2-make sure your carbs are clean. especially your pilot (or mixture) circuits, and that all four are equal on mix and vacuum (bet your off on both)
#3-new plugs

I would also follow the previous advice and replace that rinky-dink fuse panel. You can keep your glass fuses (if you want) just not the crappy assembly.

My 550 exhibited similar behavior after I bought it. Two pilot circuits were clogged, 3 floats were just below spec, battery was dying, fuse box was original. All the above was done and now it runs better than it should-NO LIE.

 

thanks guys,i took battery in, and shes tested fine, ive taken the starter out,and started taking her apart, wow,how dirty,so clean up,
im also putting another loom in,instead of the crap one on at mo,
next i will change fuse box, and ive fond a place,that does aftermarket diaphrams,$20 each,so as i havnt got a yics tool,or carb balancers, how many turns out,as standard on the mixture screws,

 

Sounds like progress.

Some tips:

Be careful reassembling the starter; it is very possible to get the brush plate back in place in the wrong position, causing it to spin backwards. Hopefully you made some "indexing marks" of your own. Consider new brushes.

Make sure those aftermarket diaphragms are for the MIKUNIS on your 550 and not the Hitachis on the bigger Maxims. And check your PM (Private Messages.)

A YICS tool can be as simple as a large cotton rag (don't use nylon) soaked in oil and twisted into a rope pulled into the chamber.

You can make your own 2-pot sync tool with a 6' hunk of clear tubing zip-tied to a yardstick and a few CCs of ATF.

A good starting point would be 2 1/2 ~ 2 3/4 turns out. I'd go "fat" to start.

Once you're ready to get into the carbs, this might help: http://xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic/t=31061.html

And be sure to carefully wet-set (verify anyway) the float levels: http://www.xj4ever.com/setting%20fuel%20levels.pdf

 

well stripped it all out, put new loom in, new battery,and plugs,and still the only way she will fire up,on the button, is a little tiny spray of carb,or easy start on the k n n filters,i mean,a little spray,

 

Using the "choke" (enrichment circuit?) If it will now fire using the starter, you've solved the electrical bit.

However---

If you still need starting fluid, your enrichment circuits aren't clean; probably the "wells" in the float bowls.

Did you make a sync tool and get the carbs truly set? Check the float levels "wet" using fuel and clear tube?

It's NOT going to light right off as it should if the carbs aren't right; especially with the K&N.

 

i can get a new yics tool for $20 but was told its usless,if got k n ns, id love to have the main airbox in, but i got no carb rubbers,with it

 

The type of air cleaners you run has nothing to do with blocking the YICS to sync.

The YICS passage is cast into the top rear of the cylinder bank, and mates with "uplink passages" in the head. You can use a YICS tool or an oil-soaked cotton rag; either way the goal is to block the YICS passage for doing the sync.

 

ok ta, so who invented yics then, :roll: and y

 

Yamaha did.

The YICS passages open out just behind the heads of the intake valves.

The way it works is this: the YICS passage is "open" to the intake tracts of all 4 cylinders. When an intake valve is closed, a percentage of its fuel/air charge goes to help fill the YICS chamber. When an intake valve opens, it gets a "boost" of this charge from the YICS chamber, which it gets from the other cylinders whose intake valves are closed. This blast of additional fuel-air mixture shoots out from behind the head of the intake valve and "swirls" the charge in the combustion chamber. This supposedly increases power and because it improves combustion efficiency, improves mileage as well.

Does it work? It seems to; back in the day the 550 was touted as having "750 punch" while getting 53mpg. I get 52~56mpg and I run the bejabbers out of my Seca.

Here 'tis:




In the pic below, the green arrow is pointing at the YICS passage plug, and the blue squiggle indicates the passage that goes up into the head.

 

so if i use a rag,itll have to go from one end to the uther,as theres one nut on each side,

 

Correct. Remove both plugs, then use a wire hook to pull your twisted oiled rag into the passage.

Be sure the rag is thoroughly saturated, but let it wring itself out as twisted; you don't want to dump a whole lot of oil into the passages.

You only block the YICS passage to sync the carbs, so have your balancing tool at the ready.

The only truly difficult part is that the bike needs to be fully warmed up to sync.

 

One thing is not totally clear in my mind: before you start sync'ing the carbs, do you put the YICS passage plugs back in after you put the oiled rag in, or only the oiled rag without the passage plugs?

 

Linen or Cotton Tee-shirt makes for good material to stuff the YICS Passage.
Marvel Mystery Oil is an ideal product to saturate the cloth.

Clip the ends of the cloth enough to refit both Plugs.
Leaving the Passage unplugged would let vacuum draw the product used to saturate the cloth through the YICS orifices.

 

Thanks RIck

COuld you explain why MM Oil would be better than any other oil for that purpose?

 

Personally, I'd recommend just using motor oil for the heat-resistance.

 

When you say "saturated" with oil, I understand that the rag should be soaked in oil, then squeezed hard enough until oil stops dropping, right?

BTW, I like your drawing, Fitz, very well done!

 

Yes.

And it's Yamaha's drawing, not mine. From when YICS was introduced.

 

MM oil is an upper cylinder lube so it's more like gasoline than straight motor oil and as such won't influence the mix any. Either way I don't think its a big issue which type you use as only a tiny fraction will be atomized and drawn in under vacuum.

BTW Honda engineers copied Yamaha's design in their small I-4 car motors, albeit with slight alterations to pass infringement laws, so it obviously had merit and functionality. This was before either of them had solid rep in the US so they only did things that actually worked.

 

As mentioned, Marvel is a Top Cylinder lube. Safe.
I love the stuff.
If I could go-back to the 50's, ... I'd use it to style my Ducks-azz hair-do.

If you take an old Tee-shirt, ... and cut the hem off the bottom ... you can then make a continuous 1-Inch Strip by circling-around the body of the Tee-shirt.

A 30-Inch section of Fiberglass Driveway Marker Rod or Wooden Dowel makes an Ideal Ram-rod.

 

Better to pull the oiled "rope" through, tightly twisted, with a wire loop made from a coat hanger or other stiff wire. Once the twisted rag is pulled through, releasing the pulling/twisting forces allows it to "relax" a bit and ensure the passage is plugged.

Gee, you'd think I must have used this method once or twice before I got my YICS tool... 8O

 

The "RickCoMatic Stuff" was introduced to the Forum:

April 27, 2007

http://xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic/t=4 ... rt=15.html

 

Aren't you afraid that some cotton fibers could separate from the t-shirt strip and get sucked in the carbs, then in the engine?

 

No.
The material is saturated with Oil.
Vacuum between chambers is restricted.
Even if a fiber did escape to the combustion chamber it would be incinerated and reintroduced to the environment as heat.
The process is the Stuffing of the Chamber.
What material you use is up you.
Tee-shirt has been used with great success.
The most important caveats are non-melting and easily removable.

 

Hi there,

Whereabouts are you ? If you're in London you could borrow my YICS tool and I have good vacuum gauges.

I skimmed through the posts. I'm not saying that anyone's views are wrong, but I suspect that my XJ has always run on a tighter budget (and the bike has been rattier) than a lot of other people who post. You said that you can bump start the bike and it ticks over, but only until you turn the lights on.

You haven't said if that applies if you're riding up the road at 30-40mph and switch the lights on. Does the bike cut out, or does it just not tick over any more ? (I might be showing my age if I don't expect all my bikes to tick over without attention when stopped at the traffic lights, though I'm pleased to say my XJ550 does.)

Please DO believe everyone when they say that thoroughly cleaning the carbs does make a difference though. Some of the suppliers in the states (Sirius I think) do separate diaphragms that have worked well for me. Old diaphragms that have holes sealed with liquid tape will be good enough to get the bike running so you know everything else is good before changing those if you want.

I only check the site occasionally, but if you are local and message me I'll get an email telling me and I'll give you a phone number.

Best of British ;-)

 

hi mate yes im in bournemouth, now if i turn the lights on, it dips,on revs, but dusnt die, ive just bought a new yics tool,$35.00 inc posting, bargain,i think,as wife has 750 version,and 3 uthers have xj,s just would love to find a second hand set of diaphrams,or carbs, even if of a xj600, pre diversion

 

So is it starting ?

When you start it after a few days I presume that you're setting the tap to 'prime'. It can be easier to start these when they need fettling by push-starting them. I've been doing that to mine for ages as I need to look at my starter motor again, but I've just bought one for £11 on EBay so that should be sorted next week.

Does that mean the bike is rideable and useable ? It's always so much easier to improve the running of an already functioning bike than find all the little bits wrong that contribute to stopping it from going. Cleaning the carbs well enough to get as-new running seems to be a bit of voodoo, but I struck lucky with an excessively OCD person who had stripped an engine and sold carbs which gleamed as part of the lot. If you buy carbs you'll probably have to clean them anyway, though I might know someone who has a set.

 

cool,i dont mind cleaning, as i have that prob, as i got a mk1 1200 bandit with 6,500 miles from new,use it for a ride,then 2 hours cleaning,


funny as i rode it 5 miles down the rd yesterday, and at lunch today she fired on the button, there is a nack so i belive to start these 550s, i found out how, now i forgot,

as to carbs,its the diaphrams i need, i just bought a yics tool, waiting for that,but love the size of the frame, sooner than later, maybe after summer, i might see if i can find a 650-700-750 and plonk that in,aswell as the shafty,

and i might know where there is a single seater chop xj550, guys just done the valves ect,taxed moted,,

 

Be sure to get a set of JIS Screwdrivers to use when cleaning the Carbs.
Having a Screwdriver which fits the Slot of the Jets allows their extraction without damaging the Slot due to the Brass bending and deforming and eventually breaking rendering the Jet needing to be drilled out.