Progress on Valve checks and questions along the way.

Ok so i am taking my time doing this valve clearance check, because i know i am opening a can of worms. I am going to need to replace atleast 2 exaust shims, and proboly more. I am going to need a new valve cover gasket, and donuts.

I got the crank case cover off, and only had issues with 2 of the 4 bolts, I am looking to replace all four with Socket Head Screws. What threads are on them?

My Pickups look kind-of corroded, are they still good?

and is that square nut a 19mm because it was a very tight fit?

 

Screws are M6 X 1 by whatever length you need. If the plugs fire those pickups are good but spray them with some WD40.
I use a cresent wrench on the square nut.
A simple degree wheel will make the shim job quicker

 

never thought of the degree wheel.

Thanks.

 

Set the first one and all the others will be 0, 90, 180, or 270 from there.
On that cam then do the other cam

 

sweet, and "T" is top dead center on cylinder 1? what is "C" and "U"?

 

"C" is where you line up the pointer to adjust the cam chain tensioner. Dunno about that "U" shaped symbol; may have to do with "firing" position as it's a few degrees BTDC.

You also don't really need a degree wheel; you just need the cam lobe to be pointing "straight up" in relation to the face of the shim.

Yes, the square projection is a 19mm if you use an open-end wrench.

Don't look at adjusting your valves as a "can of worms." It's simply routine maintenance that will need to be done again every 5000 miles. After you've done it two, three, four times it becomes pretty mundane.

 

yep your right Fitz, you don't really need a degree wheel. you can guess eight times what "straight up" is or use a degree wheel like the rest of the world does.
i would think something that's stressed so much as something that NEEDS to be done would be taken a bit more seriously than eight good guesses
just say'en

 

ok update, i opened up my valve cover. it wasnt as bad as i thought. It was overflowing with oil, had the bike on the side stand... 1st lesson learned.

my metric feeler gauges are comming in shortly. but i used my decmil. here is what i got.

for exhaust side: .102mm-.127mm, .152mm-.178mm, .152mm-.178mm, and .102mm-.127mm
for intake side: .127m-.152mm, .102mm-.127mm, .102mm-.127mm, and .076mm-.102mm

so what are they supposed to be?
exaust .160mm-.200mm
intake .110mm-.150mm

so even with my standard feeler gauges, i can tell my valves are tight or way tight. except for cylendar 1 intake. so thats 7 new shims. i need to redo this with metric feeler gauges.

 

I don't know that "the rest of the world does" (use a degree wheel.) Yamaha didn't seem to feel that it was necessary (not mentioned in the FSM.) Yes, this NEEDS to be done REGULARLY. But it's NOT that finicky of a process once you've experienced it a few times. "Eyeballing" the cam lobe to be in the correct position seemingly works fine for most folks.

jchalo99 Not necessarily 7 NEW shims, you could swap over appropriately sized shims from other cylinders once you "read" them and see what is currently installed. Finding 7 of 8 tight on a bike with untouched valves is not uncommon at all. Good catch.

 

@jchalo99
You'd better check your clearances once again with your metric gauges, because according to your first readings, it is fairly possible that intake #2 and #3 are on the tight side of specs, and #2 and #3 exhaust as well.

 

i am using a degree wheel next time, i see the benifits. it would be alot faster. because i am trying to find the biggest one that will fit, and turning a little bit at a time seeing if it changes. I do plan on redoing the reading with the correct tools, because there is not enough accuracy to continue. the metric ones i am getting are from .050mm - .250mm with i believe 100 blades. so i am hoping it would work better.
once i get money i am ordering the valve shim tool, should be ordering tomarow hopefully. and then i will read the shims, i think it is safer with the tool rather than wire or zip-tie. i have replacement socket head cap screws for the crank cover. the valve cover i am looking at refinishing with paint and polishing while it is off.

 

ZIP-Tie method works great also......and alot less hassle....

 

I think a heavy gauge wire works better - less chance of it getting cut and falling into the cylinder like one of our members experienced.

 

I use the zip tie, don't use a degree wheel, can do the check between 15min and 1/2 an hour. I don't need a degree wheel cuz I can see the cams and can easily see when a lobe is pointing directly away from the shim.

Dave F

 

Like you guys said; once you've done it a couple of times, it gets easier and faster. From the time it goes on the center stand to the time I restart it is about one hour. And all the tools are put away as well.

I use the valve tool from Motion Pro. 20 seconds to install, 20 seconds to remove. No degree chart, just use your eyes for "straight up".

Just don't back the cams onto the tool. Very bad things will happen. Search for the tutorial on valve adjustment.

 

Keep in mind if you use the shim tool to hold your valves open disconnect your battery. Here's why.

Also when using the tool there are times when you must turn the engine in the "wrong" direction (this won't hurt it). Take caution not to rotate a cam lobe into the tool or you'll end up with a cracked head.

And to stir the pot a bit I agree that a degree wheel is unnecessary. Not saying it won't work, but it's not hard to just look at the lobes.

 

Thats why the zip tie might be the preferred method......no chance of breaking the head cover by backing the cam lobe into the tool....& snap....you are screwed then.....

if a piece of zip tie breaks...it will melt during combustion.....no big deal.....fold the zip tie in half & insert...it should never break off that way....

 

here's a link to a degree wheel that fits on the ignition rotor. get one lobe right and put the wheel on with a line lined up with your pointer and take it from there.
there's also a shim calculator someone made that works real nice, thanks whoever you are. excel and open office formats
degree wheel and calc
none of this is in the factory book, they didn't feel it was necessary

 

I wonder what size (width, thickness) of zip-tie would work the best?

 

a kind of big one thats not brittle. i put the end with the knob in and get that wedged in

 

**UPDATE** I checked the book. The squared-off "U" is indeed the "firing" mark; if you throw a timing light on it that's where it should be firing when running at 1200rpm.

 

ok so zip tie method is ok to do? shouldn't knock crap free and mess with the carbon? depends on how much money i can get, but i would still try the tool. if i don't like it i can sell it to my friend that just bought 3 xj bikes. (2 of them are twins, almost the same vin, just the last digit is 1 off.)

and let me get this straight, for the zip tie method you take out the sparkplugs, rotate the cam untill valve is fully open. stick ziptie down spark plug hole and under valve. and than you can rotate around to get shim out? how meny people have/are using this way sucessfully?

sweet thank you, good info to have to check timing? but how would you adjust it if its off, i thought this was maintenance free ignition?

 

Question. at my work i am not aloud to stack feeler gauges together to get a different size. but is it alright to do? EX. the .003in and the .0015in to make .0045in? because the metric feeler gauges came in but they are not quality. and i dont trust them.

 

You can double up the gauges but you will lose accuracy. That's why you're not allowed to at your work.

The Motion Pro tool is inexpensive. Click here.

 

You can "double up" feeler blades for this operation, it's NOT THAT precise.

The drawbacks to the "zip tie" method are indeed the potential to knock loose/disturb carbon deposits on the seat and valve head; plus the possibility of compromising a stiff but still-functioning valve stem seal.

The timing mark IS just for checking. There is no adjustment (they are "maintenance free") it's either right or there's a real problem somewhere

 

ok so i am going to continue with my SAE Feeler gauges because i know they are accurate. and i am going to refine my measurements to try to get as close as possible (+/- .0005in) that should be good enough. also i know to clean the gauges in-between every try.

It looks like my girlfriend is being nice with me and might be willing to let me place this order. at lunch we are discussing it more. if so order placed today have everything this weekend to get the shims out, and replace the donuts and gasket. from there i will place a second order for the shims i need.

 

ok so got home after wok went to work on rechecking the valve clearances.

Exaust side: .0075", .0085", .0045", .0045"
intake side: .006", .005", .0045", .003"

i tired to figure out the zip tie method, got the valve held down, that was easy. now how meny hands do you people have. how do you hold down the bucket and pry the shim out. my shim did not want to come out. i broke off the tip of my screwdriver (luckly i got it out)

 

That's another drawback to the zip-tie method. Doing it that way (something under the head of the valve to hold IT open) doesn't do anything as far as holding the bucket down. So the bucket wants to come up with the shim, making removal a bit tricky unless you have 3 hands.

Did you find and read this? http://xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic/t=29209.html

(I assume you already found Part 1) http://xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic/t=14827.html

 

yes i read them both but didn't think they would be practicality GLUED in there.

also it smells burnt up inside the cover... like someone took vasolene on a break rotor.

 

They're "stuck" because of the film of oil between the shim and bucket.

A burnt oil smell (and some residue) inside the valve cover is normal.

 

if you have a compressor, spin the bucket till you can get a puff of air in the notch. after you put a rag in the cam chain well

 

Why not giving the shims and buckets a shot of your favorite loosenut?

 

I dont have a true compressor, all i got is one for my air brush... at like 30 psi... so i will try that.

the tool should be here friday or saturday. so i am going to use that, looks alot simpler. along with new donuts, and gasket. so once i get that order, i will pop the shims out read them figure out what others i need and buy new ones.

 

Here is a shout out for XJ4Ever, the day i sent payment i received notification of shipment. Its pretty sweet helpfull along the entire way, figuring out what i need, and sending me info on how to check other things. very good customer service. now to wait for the parts to arrive. and see how well they work. but cost is low for everything.

 

Personally, the 'loose' bucket is one of the reasons I LIKE the ziptie method.....I can just rotate the bucket to the notch rather than having to try and guess where it will index to when the 'tool' is used instead.

dave

 

Ok well had a very unlucky day yesterday... not going into detail.
i lost a shim? i couldnt find it anywhere i didnt hear it ever hit anything. i checked everywhere up top. so i am hoping it didnt go down the chain hole.

my solution to this problem, is to use a shim from another valve. and remesure clearences. and go from there.

 

Are there pictures for the ziptie process? Lost a shim .... that sounds bad. I'm just starting on the carb and wondering what big problems will haunt me.

 

surprisingly no big problems other than loosing a shim. that was because my neighbors dog kept pissing me off i got the shim out of the bucket but the clearences were alittle to tight to get the shim out from under the cam. so i was prying and it popped free.

get the right tools, the zip tie method does work but you need to have 2 and a half hands. you need hemostats/tweezers/plastic pliers to get the shim out appropriately. there is a picture of the zip tie processes, i belive it is linked in this thread.