Got a new to me bike

Haven't worked on bikes in about a year. Bought a pickup one year ago that needed my attention. Next was a new job etc.

Now that my truck is done, I decided to start focusing on bikes again. I still have plenty of projects around, but I just couldn't pass up this deal. A 94 zx600 e with only 7700 miles and entirely complete. Picked up for $750.
Well, the mud guard is chopped but I ordered a replacement today.





Of course it's not running, but where would be the fun if I bought a runner.
I sold my ongoing fzr project to make room for this. Once it's done, I'll most likely keep it. Just way too cool...

Haven't had much time to look into it since I bought it a week ago. It cranks but doesn't seem to get fuel. I'm thinking fuel pump, relay or maybe a fuse that I haven't been able to find without taking fairings off. Tires are shot but new ones are already on their way, so are new and upgraded fork springs.
Last issue is that, according to previous owner, the second gear slips back into neutral under load.

Anywho, nice little project that can be done on weekends without requiring too much time.

Just wanted to share.

Gabor

 

Well you will get noticed riding that bike. Sorry to see the FZR go.

Tony

 

Hey Tony,
Yes, my fzr was an awesome bike but it's been sitting in pieces for almost a year now bc I just didn't get to it. I did get some good money for it though.
Two months ago someone just handed me his 98 CBR900RR including title for free. He was way over his head into that project. So if I feel like doing a bike like the fzr again, I already have a great platform just sitting there

 

Congrads on a nice looking bike. A little worried about the second gear slip, but if you like working on bikes well there you have it. For that price and the way she looks how could you pass that up?

 

Thanks. Yes, not a single scratch or dent. Only cracks are on left tail fairing, but still in one piece and not noticeable from 6 feet away.
The second gear issue apparently is a known issue with plenty of how-to documentation.
Not a huge deal, just very time consuming.
But first get her running right, do the super soft front forks, tires and general tune up. Transmission thing can wait until it's warm outside.
Funny thing is that I already have someone who might be interested in buying once it's fixed. We'll see if I want to give her up then.

 

You should be able to test that fuel pump easy enough, but that still has carbs and no throttle bodies I think? I would guess it will be a easy fix. We had -15 this morning, so not thinking of riding yet....I am still waiting on two shims for the Seca...

Let us know what you find out.

 

Will do.
Already have plenty of experience from fuel pump and relay issue on my FZR so it should'nt take too long to figure it out.
And yes, still carbs.
I'll hook up an external tank straight to carbs while pump is out and see what happens.
If all goes well this will happen on Sunday.

 

Spent one hour trying to figure out how to remove the fairings. Can't believe I was not able to do it and am now reading the manual.

Saw a few metal flakes in oil. Hmmm.

Pulling all fairings tomorrow as well as tank and wheels. Have new tires and wheels bearings waiting to be installed. I will also try to get it started and see what's up with the fuel pump. Got new oil, air filter as well as spark plugs that go in tomorrow.
I have new and upgraded fork springs (racetec) that will go in when the front wheel is off.

Last but not least i got a replacement for the chopped rear fender. With that, the bike is fully back to stock.

 

You have to love all those little hex screws and all the copper with rubber grommets all over the place. When I put HIDS on my ZX14 taking that all off for the first time was no joke. So I totally understand going to the manual to do it. Putting it back together was more like tab A fits in tab B and then line up the 6 + cowling screws...Have fun.

That is still a really clean looking bike. No worries about the flakes as long as there is not lots and lots of them. You never know what the PO did.

 

After consulting the manual, removing the rest of the fairing was a breeze. Just crazy that everything has to come off just to remove the side fairings. I did find at least three screws that had red thread lock on them. No wonder I had a difficult time getting them removed.
Bike looks really clean under all the plastic, even the foam inlays look good. Wiring is intact too. Big relief.

 

Well, pulled everything, checked pump and relay. Both work.
Hooked up external fuel tank straight to carbs.
I have spark and fuel in carb bowls. Bike cranks but still won't start.
A bit at a loss now, but unless there is a weird safety feature that I am not aware of, the only thing I can think of is carbs. Unless something is terribly wrong inside the engine.

 

As far as the weird the only thing I can think of is the Tip sensor. I think most the the newer bikes have a tip sensor to turn off the fuel pump when and if the bike goes on it's side while running. You have already bypassed that.

Compression test, leak down test, take a good look inside each chamber if you can and see if all the pistons are in good shape. I would guess the valves have never been attended too, so that could be a issue with hard starts.

I think you are on the money with the carbs, spray some starter fluid in them as you are cranking and see if she fires. If she does, pull the carbs and run through them. If I remember right, pulling the carbs on the more modern bikes is MUCH easier than the XJ bikes or bikes from the 80's in general.

 

Pump works. When I cranked it remaining fuel shot out. So I say no to tip sensor. And yes, i bypassed it anyway.

Bike has 7700 miles, valves would be too early, no?
I will check the compression next, then pull carbs (after trying with starter fluid). Engine is not sized, I can turn rear wheel with some effort. So I'd almost say compression is good, but will measure.

I feel like this is going to be something stupid. I was told bike ran last fall. Carbs must be really effed up not to let any gas to engine.

Anyway, really appreciate the suggestions. I will try all of what you said and see what happens.
Hopefully I find another hour or two today

 

Question: choke bypasses the idle adjuster screw, correct?
I had someone play with the idle adjuster screw when I brought the bike home. Don't think that's it but you never know.

 

Yes it should, running with choke on and carbs clean should run the bike even if the idle screw is backed off. I little throttle play will also cheat the idle screw too. Not loose throttle but giving it a little twist as you try to start the bike.

 

Bike fires on starter fluid.
Will remove carbs.
One concern though:
Have a nasty and loud metallic ticking. It stops when higher idle but I'm not liking it.

 

You will not believe what I found when I pulled the carbs....

 

Close up



I guess that explains that awful sound...

Now I'm scared of what else I might find.

 

That would have to be a first! OMG!!! So are those carbs set at a 45 degree going into the cylinders? So that gravity was not helping and it was hitting the valve? At least it was so big that it didn't hurt anything and was just making a noise (I hope).

I would pull the plugs and get a good light down each cylinder and take a good hard look. Lets hope that is the one and only things you find on that really nice looking bike.

As I was pulling snow off the pole shed I remembered you said some of the screws on the body panels had red lock tight. I know that depending on the area of that screw it will have vibration and some my need blue when they go back in. I seem to recall after my engine work on my ZX14 that one or two of the screws backed out. I put blue on all of them after that.

 

Clip inside the carbs, hope that is all it's a nice bike.

 

Yes, 45 degrees.
Going over carbs now.. So far everything looks ok.

And yes, fingers crossed the noise came from that. Definitely the side the noise was coming from

 

Wow! Looks like a fuel line clamp. Doesn't look like it's chewed up or damaged though, and wonder if that was your noise or is there something else that got ingested into the engine, or a more serious mechanical issue?

You mentioned metal fragments when you drained the oil. If it was a very small amount, it may be from the 2nd gear trouble that is a potential concern. Of course your taking the word of the previous owner at this point, and I sure hope that it's not something too severe.

Tony

 

I do hope the noise came from the clamp. It did came from that cylinder. Fingers crossed. I wanted to pull wheels for new tires but get stuck trying to fix the issue.

 

Well, been trying to get her running by cleaning carbs. Just put everything back but still no luck.
Done for today. I will check compression in morning.

 

Well, still have that awful loud ticking.
So it was not the clamp. Shame. Was hoping it would be an easy fix.

Will do compression test just to see where I am then possibly drop the engine completely. Might as well take care of the second gear while I'm at it.

 

That is a very positive outlook! I would make sure the bike runs before you put new shoes on her How did the carbs look? Anything green or growing in them? Lots of carb cleaner and high pressure air? You ran through them in an afternoon, so I am guessing they looked really good when you took the off.
Keep plugging away and I hope you find the noise in the engine and it is not a bad thing.

 

Yes, carbs looked pretty good. Didn't see anything and cleaned the bit that was in there. The only thing that I'm not sure about is the pilot screw.
I was not able to see through end to end on all 4. The manual didn't specify anything and I was not able to get a fine needle through. So yes. Maybe that's the issue. Ill pull them again and soak them for a day or two.

Regarding tires: well, I already have them and getting them installed, including bearings, only costs 50 or so. So might as well do that. Same for fork springs.
Getting it done means I can focus on the last remaining parts: engine and carbs. Plus it gives me small success stories.

 

Did compression test and all 4 are at 160.
Started taking stuff off the bike and had a look under the valve cover. Nothing alarming there.
Going to strip bike more tomorrow to prepare for engine drop in a few days.

 

Carbs go to Dave for detailing while I take care of engine.
Once done this bike will be sweet.
Haven't seen anything else that worries me. Still a good deal.

 

Whatever you sink into it beyond your $750 purchase is well worth it.
The cosmetics appear perfect.
A mid-90's 600 sportbike still offers way more performance than is sanely usable on the street.
I like it.

 

I agree.
So far I spent 250 on tires and bearings, 100 on upgraded fork springs as well as 40 on the original tail.

I guess another 300 on gaskets, fluids and misc parts. And that should be it and will give me a solid classic. Plus, I went over everything on the bike and know it's safe. Can't beat that.

 

Saftie,
Still can't wait till you find the noise and or why she is not running. Good idea to have those carbs really gone through. If she was talking to you (popping) I am guessing something up with the carbs. So you are going to pull the engine?

 

Yes, will definitely pull the engine. This way I can address the second gear issue as well. Plus valve clearance when all is back together. Pulling the engine is a quick job, just all the fluids are a pain to drain.

Sometimes I wonder if the start issue could be related to vacuum. There is just so much vacuum stuff going on with the bike, tubes going everywhere.
Even with starter fluid, it took a while to kick in., As if it wasn't sucked in but had to work its way down.

 

Yes getting all the stuff off away from the engine is a challenge. That and not dinging the radiator or messing up any of the wiring harness. Glad you have a plan on the second great issue and that way as you said you can be for sure. Those compression numbers were nice!

 

Any unusual noises when cranking it over for the compression test?

Sometimes a dead cylinder, i.e. lack of fuel, will give a popping or misfire sound back through the carbs.
Hopefully that will be taken care of after the Carb Wizard (Hogfiddles) goes through them.

Also looked at the parts diagram of the valvetrain. Those have small adjusting screws/lock nuts with a single rocker actuating two valves. Could have a loose one that would cause a lot of racket when going to open a valve.

Tony

 

So true and they are so much nicer IMHO to adjust than the shim type. Sure hope that is it.

 

No unusual sounds when cranking, everything sounds normal. No popping or backfire at any time.
Once it runs, there is a certain rpm range when it's metal on metal. It goes away at higher rpm.
All seems to be coming from cylinder 1, maybe 2, but def on left side.

Looking under the valve cover, there is a lot of red marker highlighting certain positions (Ex, In) as well as on parts down in there.
The cover bolts didn't require much force to loosen, don't think they were torqued down correctly. I'm sure someone s been in there before.

 

Found a video that sounds exactly like what I'm hearing:

 

That sounds more like an exhaust leak at the exhaust collar

 

If it is exhaust leak, I guess you could use some smoke as a test tool. Blow it around the exhaust area as it connects to the head and see if the smoke moves? If you don't smoke then just a small wood bit or even dried tree branch, something that will give you smoke to push to the exhaust area.

My ear is thinking tappet in the valves is loose or out of spec. I only say that as it really sounds like metal on metal sound. Not like main crank bearing and the piston is hitting but more like valve tappets.

 

Sounds like valve train noise to me, or potentially something jammed in the piston top hitting the combustion chamber at TDC?

You are taking it out anyway for the 2nd gear fix. Get it on the bench and verify all the valve clearances are correct before you dis-assemble it. Hopefully you'll find one or two way loose and be able to correct it with out much trouble.

Tony

 

Yes, engine will def come out. Hopefully this weekend. Trying to locate an engine gasket set at the moment.
Was looking for the diagram to find the "adjusting screws/lock nuts with a single rocker actuating two valves" that you mentioned. Haven't been able to find the correct one yet (and manual is in my garage).

 

Here's the valvetrain view link from Babbits:
https://www.kawasakipartshouse.com/oemparts/a/kaw/50a98901f8700218fcc090f8/valve-s

And a Japanese source from E-bay on the gasket set:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/85-96-KAWA...969019?hash=item2111d31d3b:g:tCcAAOSwmtJXakGE
(Bought the FZR1000 gasket set and carb kits for the FZX Mikunis from them: Good Stuff BTW)

Tony

 

Ah ok.
Your diagram is a different year. Didn't see that for a 94. Maybe that's why.
Thanks for the eBay link.
I also sent an email to Babbitt's and bikebandit as I like buying from them, easier with returns too

 

Crap, sorry about that, thought it was a 96? 600R not the ZX-6.
And that engine looks to be shim under bucket like the Maxim X:
https://www.kawasakipartshouse.com/oemparts/a/kaw/500b230af8700223e478b6ed/valve-s

Either way, just verify all the clearances before dis-assembly.

Tony

 

Yes sir, will check before disassembly.
And yes, under bucket just like the FZR.
In case they are the same, I'll definitely reach out to you. If I remember correctly you are running a shim pool for those.

 

Shims under bucket, well good thing you are pulling the engine. I guess once you do it and get past the not knowing jitters, doing those type are not bad. My first go at it was interesting but then once you get how to line up the cams, chain and screw them down, it is okay.

 

Yes, did it twice on FZR engines. Did it with engine in bike. A bit of a pain and nerve wrecking because you don't want to drop stuff into the engine. This one will be easier.

 

Well, not running a shim pool, but do have extras from all the engines I've done.
Dave has some too, but believe only for the Yamaha's.

Much easier with the engine out for sure. Some shim kits are offered by Wiseco and Hot Cams, but not sure if they are compatible for that engine.

Tony

 

Guess I'm dropping the forks completely as well and will check how straight they are.
Wanted to remove fender but it's wedged in there, even though it should slide out.