1. Hello Guest. You have limited privileges and you can't "SEARCH" the forums. Please "Log In" or "Sign Up" for additional functionality. Click HERE to proceed.

Clutch Adjustment & Clutch Cable Replacement Procedure

Discussion in 'XJ DIY How-To Instructions' started by RickCoMatic, Nov 23, 2006.

  1. macros10

    macros10 Member

    Messages:
    480
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Newport News, Virginia
    Since my issue seems to be a clutch issue, I moved to this thread. So, now when I pull the clutch in and put it in gear, the bike starts to roll with the clutch lever still pulled and when I release it, the bike dies, like the clutch isn't engaging/releasing.......feels like I'm close and maybe it's an adjustment thing. So I adjusted from the handlebar side, very little lash and now it goes in gear but has the red light creep still in first, very hard to shift up into second and wouldn't shift up into third. Could I have the clutch working backwards, so that when pulled it thinks it's in gear and when out things it's in neutral? Or is it just not disengaging fully? Sorry, but I can't wrap my minds around the mechanics here..
     
  2. bigfitz52

    bigfitz52 Well-Known Member Premium Member

    Messages:
    21,283
    Likes Received:
    415
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Rural SE Michigan 60 miles N of Motown
    Here's the "mechanics:"

    The pressure plate is pressed against the "stack" of plates by the five (or six) springs, which makes it so the plain and friction plates "lock together" and the clutch engages. When you pull on the lever, it lifts the pressure plate away from the pack just enough that the plates can slip in relation to each other, thus releasing the drive between the engine and transmission.

    If your clutch is dragging, which it is, either A: It's not adjusted properly (and I covered the 550's throwout lever positioning in detail in the how-to) or if it IS properly adjusted, then B: something's not right in how you reassembled it, so that it's not releasing properly.

    First off, look closely at the throwout lever positioning pic. The end of the lever should be pointed at the "rear" of the little rectangular 'pip' cast into the housing, when the lever is pressed fully forward as shown. if not, reposition the lever.

    Maybe we need to go back over the assembly and see what might be amiss. What exactly did you replace?

    Did you soak your new friction plates in oil before installing?

    Did you get the "clutch boss spring" in the center of its special friction plate?

    Is that 'assemblage' in the third position "in?"

    How MANY plates were installed?
     
  3. macros10

    macros10 Member

    Messages:
    480
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Newport News, Virginia
    Throwout lever is aligned with the mark on the housing, I replaced the friction plates after soaking them overnight. There were 7 plates total I believe because that last one went to the 6 o'clock position like in your how-to. The boss spring is in the correct place, however, I didn't see a special friction plate or metal plate. Your write up said it had a different OD, is that overall diameter? Is it a friction plate or a metal plate that is special. I'm feeling strongly that there may lie my problem. If it's a friction plate that is special, I didn't see one that looked different in the ones that came out. I had a new set of plates to install, and a used set from an 8k 550 that I could have used. Neither set had any friction plates that were different looking. I'll take it apart and be looking at it all again. Can you tell me anything more descriptive about the special plate and does the boss spring fit against it somehow?
     
  4. macros10

    macros10 Member

    Messages:
    480
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Newport News, Virginia
    I stand corrected, I looked over the original friction plate set that came out and there is one plate that is different, it appears to have smaller or shorter tabs and a smaller ring diameter than the other plates (was looking for larger OD, is there a difference in the Maxim and Seca plate sets?). Could this be it? It's also the 3rd one in the stack, not sure if it was coming or going. Checking new stack to see if there is one like that in there. We'll get to the bottom of this yet, lol.

    Ok, the new set had a ring like that also, it even had little notches at the top and bottom so you could tell the difference, I"m such a moron, lol. Putting it back together now, let's see if that makes a difference!

    update: Victory! It turned out to be the order of the plates, and my "special" friction plate ended up being smaller SD diameter and had little notches on the 12 and 6 oclock tabs. Once buttoned all back up and clutch adjusted, rides like a dream! Thanks Rick and BigFitz and everyone for your invaluable information!

    p.s. and it did that "pop" again on reassembly. Sounded like a friggin new jar of jelly getting opened, scared this sh*t out of me, lol. Some of my plain plates were slightly warped, I figure between that and the springs compressing, it was just pushing the whole stack down and popped when seated, who knows.


    Mac
     
  5. bigfitz52

    bigfitz52 Well-Known Member Premium Member

    Messages:
    21,283
    Likes Received:
    415
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Rural SE Michigan 60 miles N of Motown
    OK, so you didn't carefully read and follow the how-to as meticulously as you thought.

    The "special" friction plate has a larger ID (and therefore a "narrower" friction area) to accomodate the clutch boss spring (wave washer.) I'm glad you got that figured out.

    However, you missed an important point: Those warped plain plates needed to be replaced. If you KNOW that you have some warped plain plates, order up a new set and get them changed out. No sense beating up on the other new components by running them.

    Are you tightening the bolts up in a criss-cross pattern, a little bit at a time? If not, that could be the reason for the "pop."
     
  6. macros10

    macros10 Member

    Messages:
    480
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Newport News, Virginia
    Will get the new plates ordered...your logic is sound, lol. I did indeed tighten the bolts up in a criss-cross pattern, perhaps with too many revolutions per bolt, we'll see what happens when the new plates come in. Thanks for your help! :)
     
  7. bigfitz52

    bigfitz52 Well-Known Member Premium Member

    Messages:
    21,283
    Likes Received:
    415
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Rural SE Michigan 60 miles N of Motown
  8. grigalid

    grigalid New Member

    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    what would cause a chatter every time the clutch is engaged?
     
  9. RickCoMatic

    RickCoMatic Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    13,843
    Likes Received:
    64
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Massachusetts, Billerica
    Drive Discs that are Scored or Burned badly.

    Friction Discs that are badly in need of replacement.
     
  10. DeMentedToys

    DeMentedToys Member

    Messages:
    112
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    Durango, CO
    I just replaced my clutch discs because when trying to shift from nutural it would grind then clunk into gear and the engine would stall. New clutch springs and discs installed.. Same exact problem.

    Even when I use a wrench to turn the lever until it won't go further clockwise and hold it there while shifting, it still grinds then clunks into gear stalling the engine. If I had more hair I would be pulling it out. Its a 83 XJ750 Maxim. I replaced the clutch springs, alligned the dots, torqued the bolts properly in the diagonal sequence, took care when installing the cover...
    I can't figure out what Im missing. I am using a wrench to test it completely ruling out clutch lever adjustment problems.

    When I put t in 1st gear, engine off, and activate the clutch, I can spin the rear wheel with my hand but can definately feel resistance. The more I spin it the easier it gets... CRAP this is killing me. Im going to take a break. If anyone has ideas please post them before I drain the new oil and take the cover back off.

    Thanks.
     
  11. RickCoMatic

    RickCoMatic Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    13,843
    Likes Received:
    64
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Massachusetts, Billerica
    If the Clutches are still engaging the Drive Discs when the Pressure Plate is moved to release pressure on the Discs, ... the NEW FRICTION Discs may be "STUCK" from being released from the DRIVE Disc(s) because the GROOVES in the Clutch Basket are GALLED.

    The Galling prevents the Discs from Floating in their Channels.

    Remove the Discs.
    Inspect the Channels with a Magnifying Glass.
    If there are "Hammered Indentations" the Discs won't Float.
    If the condition is severe, ... you need a New Basket.

    Wipe the Channels with Nylon Pantie Hose.
    If the Pantie Hose "Snags" ... the Baskets need to have the Grooves "Dressed with a Stone"

    Replacing the Parts with ones not damaged is the best course of action.
    Ck. Ebay
     
  12. bigfitz52

    bigfitz52 Well-Known Member Premium Member

    Messages:
    21,283
    Likes Received:
    415
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Rural SE Michigan 60 miles N of Motown
    What Rick said, but you don't need to drain any oil; just put the bike on the sidestand if you need to pull the cover; you'll lose maybe a teaspoon-full.

    "Activating" the throwout with a wrench is not really a valid test either; you need to get the throwout arm installed correctly and the cable adjusted and test it that way.
     
  13. DeMentedToys

    DeMentedToys Member

    Messages:
    112
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    Durango, CO
    That makes perfect sense! With the engine off and the oil fill removed, I can see the discs sticking together when the clutch releases. I can reach them with my finger and separate them by pulling and wiggling them. I have a low mileage parts bike I can pull a clutch basket off of. Thanks for the info! I'll also put the bike on the kickstand to pull the cover, in order to avoid draining the oil. :).
     
  14. bigfitz52

    bigfitz52 Well-Known Member Premium Member

    Messages:
    21,283
    Likes Received:
    415
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Rural SE Michigan 60 miles N of Motown
    Inspect both the basket and hub; look closely at the "rub marks" from the plates.

    They should just be "shiny spots." If they're divots at all, that's what Rick's referring to. You may need to swap the hub too.

    [​IMG]
     
  15. DeMentedToys

    DeMentedToys Member

    Messages:
    112
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    Durango, CO
    I just pulled the clutch bac out. Its definately got divots worn in it. Guess I'll pull the one off my arts bike....

    While I have the basket pulled out is there anything else I should check? I see a small chain and various other parts in behind where the basket was....
     
  16. Polock

    Polock Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    9,751
    Likes Received:
    2,093
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Beaver Falls, PA
    that little chain drives the oil pump, there's really nothing else back there unless your splitting the cases
     
  17. DeMentedToys

    DeMentedToys Member

    Messages:
    112
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    Durango, CO
    Allllright... So I spent 6 hours with sand paper smoothing out ALL the divots that were worn in. Then I carefully reassembled the clutch, lined up the dots nd torqued bolts to specs. Now when I release the clutch to shift from nutral to 1st it doesnt kill the engine, but it shifts hard and clunks into gear. The rear tire starts spinning before I release the clutch lever. Im going to go back through the adustment process. I even moved the little arm one notch counterclockwise. The arm is pulled all the way when I pull the hand lever, but it still clunks into gear.. Any words of wisdom?
     
  18. tskaz

    tskaz Active Member

    Messages:
    1,878
    Likes Received:
    16
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    Saint Louis, Michigan
    Sounds like you're real close.

    You will have a "clunk" when shifting into first gear. The clunk is more noticeable When the bike is cold.

    Keep adjusting and you'll get there, just don't adjust it so the throw out arm is too far back. If this happens it means you need a new cable also.
     
  19. RickCoMatic

    RickCoMatic Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    13,843
    Likes Received:
    64
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Massachusetts, Billerica
    The Cable - Throw-out Arm & Activating Rod have to be adjusted to provide as much THROW as possible.

    Read the Adjustment Procedure at the end of the Link in my signature.

    Arrange the Rod, Throw Arm and Cable to give to at LEAST this much Throw.

    IF you arrange to have this much THROW, ... with NO Slack.
    The Clutch should not make the Bike crunch into gear.

    Engaging 1st should be smooth.
    Finding Neutral should be easy.
    The Bike should not creep with the Lever pulled.
    [​IMG]
     
  20. DeMentedToys

    DeMentedToys Member

    Messages:
    112
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    Durango, CO
    I went through the adjustment process again. I finally got it to shift into gear without clunking so bad, but on the test ride the clutch was slipping alot. So I went through the process again to fine tune it, and now it clunks into gear again killing the engine. It even clunks into gear when I use a wrench to turn the clutch arm all the way clockwise until it stops then while holding it try to shift into first or second....

    Im about to load it up and haul it to the bike shop. With the arm turned all the way clockwise until it stops the clutch should be completely released and it should shift. I smoothed out each and every divot that was worn into the basket too. I have to be overlooking something. Man its frustrating. I want to ride! :)
     

Share This Page